GET INVOLVED:

You Can’t Veto the Truth

Tuesday, May 01

Today Americans United for Change released this ad in response to President Bush's veto of historic legislation to wind down the war in Iraq.

Tell George Bush he can't veto the truth. Call: 202-456-1111

 

Download Script (PDF)

Posted by AUFC Web Team

291 Comments

Currently active duty in U.S. military, and would like to express that I’m tired of hearing how America wants us home.  I’m on schedule to return to Iraq in a few months and looking forward to it.  I would rather get the job done right now and not return a few years or a decade from now.  Majority of the military just want America’s support and needed funds to continue with our mission.  And about the MISSION ACCOMPLISHED on May 1 2003, at that time we did accomplish our mission and another mission was issued afterwards.  For those that don’t know how military orders work should assist and join our volunteer armed forces.  I appreciate those Americans that just say “Thank You for Your Service”, and move on.  That’s all we ask for.
Thank You,
Garcia

Garcia in Camp Pendelton, CA | Tuesday, May 01 at 01:35 PM

I wonder what your thoughts would be (if you had any cognition) if you are hit by a brain damaaging IED during your next tour. You are already brainwashed.

Kari,Army widow, son is in Iraq and wants out in Fort Rucker, AL | Tuesday, May 01 at 01:48 PM

PLEASE MAKE SOME COMMERCIAL SPOTS SHOWING THE FANCIFUL PREDICTIONS ABOUT THE WAR BY WOLFOLWITZ AND OTHERS, “THE IRAQI OIL WILL PAY FOR THE OCCUPATION” ECT.
SPOTS ON THE THE INACCURATE FACTS THAT WERE SUPPOSED TO JUSTIFY THE WAR.

Phil Miller in SHOW THE REAL PREWAR LUNACY | Tuesday, May 01 at 01:50 PM

First, Is would like to say thank you to the men and women fighting for our freedom overseas.  And then to FDNY and NyPD for all that you gave on 9-11 may we not forget.  And to the Democrats and the Cindy Shehands in the blaming the Govertment for 9-11.  YOU PEOPLE MAKE ME SICK!!! I think Bush is doing better than some of you people ever woukd. You people want pull out because the news and the Clintons say that everything is not wounderful.  I hope that you don’t think the U.S will be better with Oboma or Clinton in office because It will be WORST.

Christopher Walters in Houston County, GA | Tuesday, May 01 at 01:59 PM

I believe that the time has long since come for our troops to return home.  I appreciate the patriotism that our troops demonstrate in wanting to fight but the fight is over.  This war, for lack of a better term, has degenerated into nothing more or less then a ‘tug-of-war’ between internal iraqi militant forces, the iragi occupational force, & the United States.  The prize being rights to that country.  Now the way that I see it is that we have no right to still be over there playing a part in how this country’s history will develop.  This situation would be most closely associated to the idea of spain interceding on behalf of the english during our own revolution.  Let these people work out their own situation.  It is time to leave the welfare of Iraq to the Iraqis.

Matthew A. McCall in Tacoma, Washington | Tuesday, May 01 at 02:01 PM

I have the greatest faith, hope, respect, and love for our armed forces. This war was started based on fabricated or twisted intelligence assessments. It has been executed without the necessary forethought and planning to allow it to ‘succeed’. The very image of what ‘getting the job done’ would actually mean had never been clearly articulated. If you can’t clearly define your destination, how could you possibly create a plan to get there? If the goal is to allow for Iraq to govern itself then that is what it’s already doing. The various sects and groups within Iraq would be fighting each other and destroying themselves if we were involved or not. Why do we continue to build a wall of corpses between groups that are to their very fiber bent on each other’s ‘righteous’ destruction? A wall bricked with the bodies of US troops and mortared with the blood of Iraqis caught in the cross fire?

How many bodies do you use to try and fill this bottomless pit? When is it enough? How can more years of bloodshed be considered ‘success’?

Make the call, let Iraq care for Iraq.

Jason Anderson in Ohio | Tuesday, May 01 at 03:53 PM

“Garcia in Camp Pendelton, CA | Tuesday, May 01 at 12:35 PM”

For a soldier, you’re remarkably well versed in RNC talking points.  It seems odd you’d say “Currently active duty in U.S. military” because that sounds rather detached.  If you said what branch, for example, it might make you post look a little more credible.  But I’m afraid I have to call the BS card and assume you to be a paid right-wing troll instead.  It would explain how you were able to find this page so quickly and be the first to post.

roger in Oakland, CA | Tuesday, May 01 at 03:54 PM

Garcia, thanks for your service. But from one vet to another, just what is the “mission” over there? Just what do you mean by “get the job done”? If it is Iraqi democracy, then the Pentagon has already stated that that isn’t their objective anymore. Who and what are you fighting?

Andrew Jamison | Tuesday, May 01 at 03:57 PM

It is disgrace that this war has become a political football. Is anyone watching the news? That is, if you can find one that doesn’t have it’s own political agenda. Watch Turkey very closely. The Turks are fighting tooth and nail to prevent Islamic extremism from taking over their government. The Turks may be strong enough to do this on their own. Iraq was not and is not. That is why we are there. That is why we should stay there. Our men and women see this and understand it. Why can’t these politicians put the good of our nation ahead of their own good? I am sick of every stinking one of them. I don’t see one candidate, one Senator or Congressperson that deserves the job that WE have GIVEN them. Let’s start over.

mary m in Greenwood, SC | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:00 PM

Hey pvt Garcia, you are just a grunt who is serving our country. It is not yours to decide for our nation. That is for the citizens of the USA, and the citizens have spoken. You might like being over there and killing little girls, but the rest of the country doesn’t want our military there. You are ruining our country’s prestige. So if you go over there, you should stay there.

Pricilla in Austin Texas | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:03 PM

People like those iun your organization cause me to believe that I was shooting the wrong enemies of America.

Jim Cooke in Rockwall, TX | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:06 PM

mary in Greenwood, I do understand what you are saying. Here in America, we are fighting tooth and nail to prevent Christian extremism from taking ove our government. Let’s hope we are strong enough to do this on our own.

Justice is Blind in Both Eyes | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:08 PM

It’s too bad this ad is also untruthful.  Just another case of the biased media.  The legislation was vetoed in part because it had spending in it such as peanut storage.  What’s up with that?

I would love for our troops to come home, but it is their work over there that has kept our country safe.  If Congress prevails and terrorism comes to the U.S., the same people who are complaining about bringing our troops home are going to be complaining about us not doing enough to prevent an attack. I say keep the politicians out of it and let the Generals do their job.

J Wood in North Carolina | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:09 PM

When I was over in Vietnam, we told the American people that if we don’t fight them there, then we would need to fight them here. And we said that communisism would take over America. Of course our leaders were lying then and they are lying now. No Iraqi’s are going to come over here unless we bring them as refugee’s, and there will probably be a lot of them.

Thnk about it. Our borders are so pourious that there are 1500 illegals coming over DAILY! Now what makes you think that we let illegal Mexicans in but not Al Qaeda operatives? If they want to come over here, we have a large border that is wide open and they know it. Our military is not doing anything over in Iraq to prevent that.

Cowboy Bob in Texas | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:17 PM

Roger/Priscilla
I was going to comment that this is run by a Democratic Party operative, but your attacks on a soldier for having the audacity to disagree with you establishes your stance on the war and the soldiers, none of this we support the soldiers from you.

Priscilla
You accuse Garcia of killing with no knowledge of who or what he does. Talk about a closed mind. You are a disgrace to the term “liberal”

Jay in Nicholasville KY | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:22 PM

Jay, why do you assume that Pricilla is a liberal? I don’t agree with her statement either but I wouldn’t put her in a liberal class just yet. She might be a right wing troll who is just trying to drum up trouble.

Rockwood in Hawaii | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:25 PM

Fear. We need to put more fear in the base. Lets drum up some more color warning alerts, even if it isnt election time yet. We gotta make em fear us or they will catch on to us. Carl, put some more scare stories out and say that Jesus talked to me some more. That oughtta straighten em out!

GWB in Washington DC | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:29 PM

I was a bit put off today when I saw your new TV ad about the presidents veto. One nation against one man.  How presumptuous of you to assume you speak for the nation.  Perhaps a better name for your organization would be- Some americans united for change, or even better- Americans of the democratic party united for change. If you think leaving Iraq now will make the world a better safer place, you’re only revealing the shallowness of your thought processes. Get Back!!  Next time you have an opinion that you can’t keep to yourself, at least express it as your own and not that of the nation. I don’t expect to see my comments posted.  Doubtfull whether there is enough intestinal fortitude in your organization to present both sides equally. AUFC should headquarter out of San Francisco not Washington, DC. JUST ONE AMERICANS OPINION.

Art C. in Daytona Beach, Fl | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:37 PM

When Bush vetos this bill he will become the reason the troops are not getting the funding they need. He is so stubborn and arogant, does not he realize that blaming the Dems for troops not getting the funds will only backfire in his face. The congress sent him a bi-partison bill today that will actually give the troops more than what Bush wanted. If he refuses to sign the bill, he is the one not funding the troops!

David A. Lewis in Cape Cod, Ma. | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:40 PM

If the mission was to create more terrorists, fill the entire Muslim world full of hate for us, fill 90% of the co-citizens of this planet full of disgust, divide our country, waste our finest people and our resources for Boy George’s pathetic weak little ego….

Mission Accomplished!

Chingebush | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:42 PM

Hey Art, they do speak for the nation. “WE the People” voted last November and they are doing our bidding. maybe you don’t like it in your neck of the woods but you don’t speak for the nation.

Art deosnt C in Not in Fla | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:45 PM

If all the draft-dodging weenies want to fight the war in Iraq, sign up and go.  Otherwise, a majority of Americans would like to see us out of the mess as soon as possible.  It’s unpatriotic to support this treasonous President and his cabal of thieves and liars.  Do the right thing for the United States of America by supporting our withdrawl and the impeachment of the President and Vice President so that we can bring dignity back to the Government and our nation.

Rudy G. in Dayton, OH | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:47 PM

“t r u t h o u t” 
ABOLISH THE MISSION
IMPEACH NOW!
freedom is NOT free!
as a matter of fact, does anyone here know what the Dom behind freedom stands for?
try this:Free Dominion”
Kingdom?
Kings Dominion.
something for you to think about.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:48 PM

You pathetic liberals just want to have Satan take over the world. If we don’t kill the islam devils over there, then we will have to kill them over here. Besides, Israel needs this war to make sure the rapture happens as planned in the good book. Stop Satan’s advancements now instead of later!

I don't Believe in God | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:49 PM

Roger
The reason Garcia could find you is your TV ad, and your website ID . All one has to do is Google and there it is, for anyone to see and comment on.

Jay in Nicholasville KY | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:49 PM

I cant wait to see the
MISSION ABOLISHED sign hanging up.
that would be a celebration

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:51 PM

you don,t believe in God.
You believe in freedom

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:53 PM

I urge the President to sign the bill and begin the process of bringing our troops home. They are in the middle of a civil war and there is no clear enemy except Al Queda(spellig?) who is a small presence in Iraq. The later the war ends the greater the number of GIs who will be killed or wounded.

Artie in NY | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:57 PM

let those who want to fight in iraq go fight and those who don’t want to fight in iraq stat home. better still isn’t there one male member of George W. Bush’s family willing to fight for his country. Britian has one. Not one man in his family nephew, cousin etc., will stand up like a man. says a lot doesn’t it

wallace in baltimore | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:58 PM

I am a calvary soldier serving in Iraq currently.  This is my 2nd tour there, I do not feel we are making much progress, if we are is it moving along slower than a slug moves.  I do enjoy my what we are doing here but how many more counseling sessions can one person take?  How many sleeping pills can one person take for the rest of his life?  How many soldiers have to suffer post tramatic syndrom?  How many more close friends do I have to witness getting blown up in insurgent attacks?  How many close friends do I have to witness get severly injured when all they are doing is helping other iraqi citizens.  We are not fighting the Iraqi populous we are fighting other people neighboring countries.  If we should fight anyone it should be them.

Nicholas A. Jansen in Fort Hood, TX | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:01 PM

One of the main things that crawls in my gut is how these pro-war neocons just won’t pick up a gun and go over there to fight. Even many of the pro-war people who post at sites like this will bash anti-war people but wouldn’t dare go over and fight themselves, but they will bash vets who reply to them. In the Army back in the day, we called these “pro-war but not gonna fight” people cowards, but now days we call them neocons. The world is definitely upside down.

Vietnam Vet in Recovery | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:05 PM

Can you see Bush carrying a rifle?  Those soft little hands were made for counting money and massaging Jeffy Lube Gannon.  He passed the Peter Principle level when he left cheerleading.

Sign the veto maricón!  Show those upstart Americans who the decider is.

Bush is worse than Cho Seung Hui, and has killed many more innocents.  At least Cho had the decency to spoil the pelt on his way out.  George?  Come on man, you can do it!

Chingebush | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:06 PM

Nicholas A. Jansen, thanks for you input and thank you very much for your service. We appreciate it greatly!

Could you enlighten us as to just who or what we are fighting over there? We hear so much BS here in the States

Paland in Sacramento | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:07 PM

Sorry
Nicholas A. Jansen in Fort Hood, TX |
thats the price of freedumb.
by the way, ever read the Abrm/Abraham story in the Bible?
it would shed light as to why father is willing to slay his own son. Greed.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:09 PM

I want to say I support our soldiers 100% and so do most Americans….it’s the war we don’t support and our president that continues to this day to lie to us that we don’t support. Why can’t people understand that?

Chris L. in Riverside, CA | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:09 PM

I understand that perfectly
Chris L. in Riverside, CA | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:09 PM
Thank You for your support for helping out the soldiers and vets.
financial help would also be nice for military veterans.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:13 PM

just google homeless veterans and you can find more info.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:15 PM

I can not say who we are fighting but we capture more people from neighboring countries than we do in Iraq itself.  And when we do fight them you can not see them or know where they are at.  It is like fighting a ghost.  (sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud, somethings I can agree with you on, but others I will not.  I am very religous and do not mix politics and religion, those two mixed is worse than any destructive force in the world.  The bible has nothing to do with the way the country is run, if it did i do not ( in my opinion) think we would be at war.

Nicholas A Jansen in Fort Hood, TX | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:16 PM

And Right You Are
Nicholas.
I Agree

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:21 PM

if the bible had something to do with the way the country is run,  i do not ( in my opinion) think we would be at war.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:24 PM

Agree?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:24 PM

By the way
Nicholas A Jansen in Fort Hood, TX
(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rudisaile
Killeen Texas

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:27 PM

Strongly agree

Nicholas A Jansen in Fort Hood, TX | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:33 PM

Copperas Cove!  GO DAWGS!!!

Nicholas A Jansen in Fort Hood, TX | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:36 PM

Nicholas A. , first God Bless you and keep you safe. I think I can speak for the majority of American people , we want our troops home,
We are in a civil war , we will not accomplish democracy or peace in that situation. It is way past time for a plan for evacuation, we have heard enough lies. To all our military in Iraq, know that we are working on bringing you home, you are not forgotten.

Sherry C. in Wethersfield CT | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:37 PM

Viet Vet
Viet Vet

Where ? When?

I went, both my sons are in military, so let’s drop the everybody that disagrees with the anti war view needs to go. Some of them already did.

jay in Nicholasville KY | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:39 PM

Maybe the President could start addressing issues such as Chavez seizing oil and our gas prices going through the roof, or the millions of US citizens without health insurance, WE WANT OUR TROOPS HOME !

Navy Corpsman Mom in wethersfield CT | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:50 PM

I think it is nessecary to have a timetable for withdrawal. Over 100 US troops died in the month of April 2007. More and more insurgents are coming, and it is just getting tougher for US troops.

The domestic effects also are very drastic. Our economy is starting to fail, and also we are lacking in proper education.

Jay Kahlon in Austin,TX | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:03 PM

jay in Nicholasville KY
R U A Viet Vet?
Where?
When?
What Branch, Rank, Serial #?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:05 PM

Viet Vet…....my brother too, Marine Corp 5th Battalion, Communication Specialist…...lest you forget…was the war in Vietnam beneficial to the US or the Vietnam Vets?

Navy Corpsman Mom | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:06 PM

no.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:09 PM

Phu loi
1971-72 with B trp 3/17 air Cav(UH1H copilot) Army 1st LT Infantry

Jay in Nicholasville | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:10 PM

Sooo, I take it you Escaped the Friendly Fire.
Congrat.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:11 PM

I just want my sons to be treated better for their service, than I was, 2nd job interview, they wanted to know if I has smoked marijuana, when I said no , they said you went to VietNam didn’t you as if everyone that was there did.

Jay | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:13 PM

Jay, You was only there for a Year.
Didn,t you tell them that?
hell, you barely even broke rank with the green…thumbs?
I forget what that nickname was for newbys.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:16 PM

But seriously Jay.
Read this again.


I want to say I support our soldiers 100% and so do most Americans….it’s the war we don’t support and our president that continues to this day to lie to us that we don’t support. Why can’t people understand that?

Chris L. in Riverside, CA | Tuesday, May 01 at 04:09 PM

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:18 PM

I too am a former US Marine and I thank god my commander in chief was not a war monging moron. You in the military who support this war wonder why you have no support at home. Here’s the answer. In WW2, the nazis occupied most of europe. How do you think the iraqis look at us. Pretty much like the europeans looked at the german soldiers patroling their streets. Second reason. The military was established to protect our people and our country. This war has achieve exactly the opposite affect. In other words, terrorism is up, Americans are in more danger than ever before 9/11 and the real war on terrorism has lost it’s focus. Keep in mind Al Queda was not in Iraq prior to the US attack. Also, Saddam Hussein kept Iran in check. Now, Iran is the strongest nation in the middle east and bent on having the bomb. I could keep writing how our military, government, and the moron who didn’t see this coming is not serving the interest of the people. The American people, as the oath of office military and presidents take, are not protecting this country or the constitution. In fact they are violating it. The first paragraph of the constitution states the government gets it power from the consent of the people. It seems to me the people no longer give consent.

Ron in Las Vegas, NV | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:23 PM

I’m prepairing for my 3rd rotation back to Iraq, not because I’m brainwashed, as Kari ignoantly accused my fellow Devil Dog of being. It’s a shame that her husbands sacrifice and her sons achievements, both given as part of the cost of freedom, not only for the Iraqi citizens but for Americans like Kari, and everyone else in this country who know more about, and spend more time concerned about American Idol and all the other fucking “reality” shows on our T.V. stations, than they spend gathering accurate and complete information on the the real reality is in Iraq and afghanistan. Let me break it down to you all K.I.S.S. style. Iraq is not a “reality” show that you can just turn off when your tired of watching it, nor is it a game that you quit playing when you loose your moral nerve to finish what you started because it no longer appeals to you. And here’s another thing, quit using the number of my fallen brothers as your determining factor of our progress, as if your keeping score in some kind of contest. In fact, quit being so damned concerned with whats going on in Iraq. You have no concept of what the situation is like there, on the ground. We are over there commited to violence every day, we take the risk of loosing our lives every second we are in country, we take with us the responsibility of knowing that the future of our country’s freedom is in our hands. We do this willingly and with honor and great pride. We know that you all back here at home are depending on us to succeed, just as we are depending you back here at home to keep America strong from the inside. Well guess what, it’s you all who are failing us. You have let your military down when we needed you the most. We’re doing our part, but instead of being focused on the issues that are tearing this country apart from the inside, you’re more concerned about whats happening in places that most of you would’nt even be able to point out on a map, yet alone explain to me what the actual situation is like. If the media circus is your only source of information concerning Iraq, then you might as well go back to American Idol, you might actually learn more. Bottom line, let us who do know what we are doing, do the job that you depend on us to do. The more you stay out of it, the better chance we have of finishing our job and bringing your sons, daughters, fathers, husbands, and friends back to you alive. Instead of calling President Bush, who does have the Constitutional authority as Commander-In-Chief of the military, contact your congressmen and urge them to stop using the vital resources, which our lives are litterally depending on, as leverage in a childish game of “who’s in control now”. And please, have faith in your military and our capibilities, our enemy have no hope of success, except for what you all back here are giving them. And more importantly, don’t loose the fear, hurt, anger, and determination that was brought to us all when these animals attacked our home, because we have’nt, and we’re not going to stop until we’re satisfied that something like September 11, 2001 can never happen again. And one final expression, Kari should be ashamed of herself, as i’m sure her husband is for even mentioning something like an IED strike on a Marine, just to get a point across. How dare she, I wonder if she would suggest something as sick and evil as that to her son, if he felt differently about something than her, no wonder he wants out of the Army, he’s probably more frightened of what she would do to him if he stayed in.  Semper Fidelis and God Bless America and all She represents, even you Kari.

Sgt. Wells, USMC in Camp Pendleton | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:26 PM

Good ad! For the several Bush defenders posting here (probably all of them wink, we had what we call “a [sic] accountability moment” last November: out with the Bush-enabling Republicans in the Congress, and in with Democrats who will bring the troops home and undo the rest of the Bush damage.

The people have spoken. They want Bush on a short leash.

Now, what’s so complicated about that?

Zandru in Albuquerque | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:31 PM

great ad, hope to see it heavily in the rotation!!!

Cathy in Dallas, Texas | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:33 PM

Hey Roger, in Oakland. if you knew anything you were talking about you would know that Camp Pendleton is A marine Corps Base. So, you were wrong by your 3rd word. So let me educate you, since you obviously never served in any branch of the military. Marines call there bases camps, the Army calls them forts, the Navy calls them stations, and the Air Force calls them bases. And thats all the time you get from from me.

Christopher Wayne Wells in Camp Pendleton | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:36 PM

Sgt. Wells, USMC in Camp Pendleton | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:26 PM
little hard on the Lady, aren,t you?
E-5 is it?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:39 PM

Looking over today’s news on this august anniversary, I was reminded of a scene from Mel Brooks’ “The Producers” (1968 film) in which a musical entitled “Springtime for Hitler” is staged on Broadway:

GOEBBELS: Heil, baby!  I just finished the morning propaganda broadcasts.

HITLER: What did you tell the people?

GOEBBELS: I told them we invaded England.

HITLER: Hey, baby, that’s good!  How’d we come out?

GOEBBELS: We won.

HITLER: Groovy!

So disgusted that I am no longer living in America | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:44 PM

And who’s kids are going to have to go back over there to fix the damage, since you can’t “undo” damage, that will be a direct result of leaving the job unfinished, Zandru? If you would try to look at the whole situation, instead of your one-sided view over a president, then maybe you’d be able to see where the complications come into play.

Wells in Camp Pendleton | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:47 PM

Wells in Camp Pendleton | Tuesday, May 01 at 05:47 PM
Whos Zandru?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:48 PM

nevermind

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:49 PM

Wells in Camp Pendleton
You ARE the kids going back over there to fix the damage.
I served 1st gulf war.
was in Somalia too.
stationed Twice in Gitmo.
Was also in Kandahar, then Baghram.
My 2nd Dau. Was at Camp Anoconda for a year.
Imagine your Daughter having to go to war to defend you and your freedoms.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:53 PM

i know i know. well, its the volunteer thing to do.
NOT!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:54 PM

Yep SFC

I was an FNG, till I flew with a W-2 we called magnet-a**, took several rounds in the bird. still better than beimg a REMF

Jay | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:03 PM

I was an FNG(foreign National Guard), till I flew with a W-2(warrant Officer 2) we called magnet-a**(ss), took several rounds in the bird. still better than beimg(being) a REMF(?).

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:08 PM

Aren,t you glad to be alive though?
(don,t answer that,LOL).

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:10 PM

rear echelon mother’s friend=remf

Some one who acts like he’s still in the states in the middle of a combat zone.

Spit shined desert boots smile in the Green Zone in Baghdad would be an example.

Jay | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:14 PM

We are really supposed to believe that our soldiers spend their time trolling on random political websites?  Only RNC hacks and Rush Limbaugh producers impersonating members of the armed forces waste their time like that.

“People like those iun your organization cause me to believe that I was shooting the wrong enemies of America.”

Jim Cooke in Rockwall, TX | Tuesday, May 01 at 03:06 PM

Jim Cooke, you can go Cheney yourself, you sicko, wanting to murder Americans for having differences of opinion.

bob in Akron, Ohio | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:18 PM

Not as hard as an IED exploding. But i’m sure she did’nt take the time to consider what she was actually saying when she typed that. It was probably the first thing she could think of that would have the stongest impact. I did’nt think it would actually take getting hit by an IED to understand thats not something you say to someone who probably has been. i’m not here to sugar coat anything, we have a serious fucking problem here in our counrty, and the way it’s being handled by both sides of the house, is a disgrase. America’s kids are serving this country and acting with more integrety and honor than is compairable to anything else current, while the older and “wiser” members of our congress are acting like kids. And that goes for both sides of the house as well. It appears to me that the people we elect into office have forgotten that their office is supposed to be for the better of the people, not for the better of the oficials. Their all so fucking concerned with their own agenda’s and recognition, Congress has turned into a 2 year enduro-race to see who can out-last who, and who can make who look the worst. Elections have become an all out race to see who can dig up the most dirt under someones feet, no matter how far they have to dig to find anything. The canidates get the population so rouzed up that neighbors are ready to kill each other just because one is a republican and the other is a democrat. but then hours after the vote is decided, here they all are saying what a great person their opponant is and what a great job they will do, although 2 days prior to the election, someone’s opponant was made to appear worse than the anti-christ. meanwhile , none of the issues which are hanging over our countries heard are ever resolved, there just tossed around until it becomes strategically centered around some fucking polititians campaign. i’m not a republican or a democrat, I’m a U.S. Marine and my mission is the protection of freedom, both here and anywhere else i’m called to defend it. Underneath the media headlinds, and behind a ruthless, evil, and brutal force, is a country of unfortunate civilians who are stepping up and hoping to one day live in a country where freedom rules not terror. and as corny as that may have sounded, imagine if you lived in a country where freedom and and justice never existed until a few years ago, oh wait, you can’t, we fought for our a long time ago, and now nobody here have a fucking comprehension of what thats like.

Sgt. Wells in Camp Pendleton | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:19 PM

Amen, Sgt Wells, well said.
Bob in Akron does not realize the technology that is available these days.
The troops in Iraq that are not out in the field have access to CNN and Fox and know exactly what Reid and company are saying, and they can get on a computer, DUH.

Jay in KY | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:25 PM

oh wait, you can’t, we fought for our a long time ago, and now nobody here have a fucking comprehension of what thats like.
Bingo.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:27 PM

Hey Bob, contrary to what certain Senators want people to belive, any one of my 2 year Marines could out-debate any 2 year political science major, it’s our asses on the line out there, i can’t stop analying this shit every waking second i’m back here. i found this web-site after i saw the sladerous commercial, while watching the news on T.V. It’s a pretty simple process, if you stop complicating things by thinking about it too long

Sgt Wells | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:29 PM

What don’t you guys get?  Every time the Bush/Cheney administration has promised that things will be better in another 6 months, they have failed to get better.  They have no idea what to do.  There is no reason to believe them or think that any plan they put out will work.  They have absolutely no credibility.  We should put zero faith or trust in them.  We can’t afford it.

Maliki barely governs Iraq.  He will never meet even the most simple benchmarks, which the Bush/Cheney admin knows and is why they don’t want any bills with any benchmarks for the Iraqis. 

We don’t have enough troops in Iraq to contain the insurgency according to Petraeus’ own manual.  “Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates, visiting Iraq last week, declared that the ‘clock is ticking’ for political progress. He urged Iraq’s parliament not to take a scheduled two-month recess and to pass by the end of summer both an oil law and a proposal to reverse the de-Baathification law.”

A few of you seem to have some basic Constitutional questions.  Here are some answers.  1. The military doesn’t get to decide how long the war lasts.  2. The Congress has the right to cut off funds to end a military conflict and has done so on multiple occasions in the past.

Casey in Pittsburgh, PA | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:29 PM

Bush will get his damn funding.  He just loves to make it sound like he is being denied the funding.  Not so!
All he has to do is sign the bill and he has his funding….pretty simple.  Anywho, the Pentagon says that they have the money even if Congress denied funding. 

They could cut the contractors excessive pay and God knows Halliburton doesn’t need the money they get.  They lost millions of dollars.  They should pay it back. 

A cook in Iraq makes $60,000/yr tax free.  My husband makes $30,000/yr dodging bullets, mortars, RPGs, and IEDs.

Bush and Cheney suck and seriously need to quit connecting Iraq to 911.  Bush is a dictator and is trying to take all our freedoms aways from us. 

I remember recently his threat that if Congress delays the bill that the soldiers and their families would suffer by getting deployed sooner, and having longer deployments.  Yeah he cares about the troops.  He is using us as pawns to get what he wants.  THAT IS NOT CARING ABOUT THE TROOPS!  Now everyone is on 15month tours instead of 12 months.  We have units getting ready to deploy to Afghanistan and their tours have now been extended to 18 months.  Now keep in mind that these are the same people that have already done 2-4 tours in Iraq and haven’t even been home 9 months in between.  How the hell are these men and women suppose to keep this crap up?  They are treated like robots.  There was no Al-Quaida in Iraq until we went there.  Great job Bush!

BTW, I’m a military wife.  My husband and I both are NOT Bush supporters….never have been and never will.  We didn’t vote for him so he is not MY President.  He is my husband’s boss but just because he is his boss doesn’t mean he has to agree with him.  And believe me when I tell you that there are alot more military that do not support this President and his unjust war in Iraq.  Despite what some poster have said not all military are pro-Bush.  It simply is not the truth.

T in Overseas | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:32 PM

Imagine yourself being born in , oh lets say, North Korea.
Was That your Choice? or, Gods Choice?
Or for that matter, Your Mom and Dads Choice?
What Choice? Do THEY Have? None. Not at the moment of Conception they don,t.
Get my Point?
Don,t Blame them for being born There.
and Don,t Punish an entire Nation for One Persons Terror.
Think About it now. Isn,t Bush Terrorizing, the so called Axis of Evil Nations?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 07:32 PM

Now. Can You Handle the Truth if I was to Give it to You?
I Don,t Know.
But, just like me. when handed the Truth. would you know what to do with it?
thats the Big Question.
I know I don,t.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 08:02 PM

What happened? did I scare everybody away?
Its so quiet in here.
oh well. Gnite

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 08:08 PM

Sorry—

I don’t have any change.

RealAmerican in TheRealWorld | Tuesday, May 01 at 09:14 PM

Great commerical, I hope they play it all the time as its the truth, bush is not for the troops in the first place if that was the case he would have not rushed in and sent troops with out body protection and armor piercing steel for the vehicles, bush and the whitehouse don’t care about the wounded troops as well, he cut funds for families here, the poor condition at the Vet’s hospitals, extended lengths of combat and shorter home visits.  If bush and the whitehouse are so worried about terrorists, why has the bush Adm. cut funds and inspectors of inspections of cargo at the ports, less then 1% is inspected, bush and whitehouse say that the “Green Zone” needs to build walls to stop unwanted persons from entering but yet they they won’t protect the borders here in the USA. 

These people have been fighting since day one. Let them kill each other and bring our troops home to guard the USA and let the Iraq’s fight for themselves….....

Norm in Texas | Tuesday, May 01 at 09:30 PM

Did I just Call Bush a Terrorist?
my Apall o lies
snicker

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 01 at 09:36 PM

Of course the veto was the right thing to do.  The Democratic bill was full of pork barrel spending, unecessary timetables, etc.  We simply cannot fight a war on our schedule, to do that is ridiculously stupid.  We must fight until the enemy is either submissive, or dead.  I don’t think the terrorists will honor our timetable.  Do you honestly think they will?  Then you are ignorant.  Imagine Washington, Lincoln, Woodrow Wilson, F.D.R., or Truman on a timetable.  We fight the war until the enemy is no longer a threat. Period.

Bush will get his funding, because the Democratic congress hasn’t the power to change anything.  And the last thing they want to be seen as is unsupportive of the military.  Remember, Harry Reid’s main objective is winning the ‘08 election, holding, and consolidating political power.  He’s made that plain in so many words.  The war on terror is secondary, or even further down the list, to him.

All I can say is some of you folks need to wise up.  Your version of the “truth” is sorely lacking in reality.

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 01 at 10:57 PM

A little clarity about personal armor and vehicle armor.  The crying shame was not that we didn’t have armor to begin with, the crying shame was that we didn’t produce armor in a hurry.  It wasn’t a priority.  In WWII weapons and armor was a priority and things got done quickly.  And the war was really over after 4 years.

David E... in san diego,fl | Tuesday, May 01 at 11:12 PM

To say “WWII was over in four years” is misleading, there was still an extensive post-war period which also led directly into the cold-war and the resulting proxy wars. We did shift manufacturing priority exclusively to war machinery however, that much is true. I think a GM or Ford plant could switch to making Cougar vehicles and it would actually improve their bottom line.

To the original poster, “Thank you for your service.”

To the rest that say, “this another example of biased media”, well, of course, all media is biased. Unless you’re reading AP or Reuters wires all day long then it’s all just media marketed for mass consumption and its sole purpose is to generate advertising dollars.

What’s sad is that most available “news” is actually just commentary; and most are unable to tell the difference.

Chris Pizanias in New York, NY | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:06 AM

As a foreigner, who of course does not know all the details of the discussions that is going on in the US, I do know this. For all the ones above stating or claiming, the Iraq war has made America more safe or it is a defense of freedom: You are very delusional. If you really think this war has made America safe think again, the US are more hated now in the world (especially the Islamic world), for every islamic fundamentalist that has been caught in Iraq, at least ten have risen out of the ashes of the current civil war.

There was no Al-Quaida in Iraq, there is now (so that made invading senseless anyway)
There were no WMD in Iraq, there may be some now (a second point of it being a sensewar war)

Iraq has always been a wasps nest, since its creation by the British a century ago. They tried to “subdue” unrest too (with no subtle means I might add), but they failed too.
This situation cannot be changed by America unless several army corps are poored into the country for an indefinite periode (my estimate would be at least another 80.000 soldiers for at least 10 years), but like any modern democracy, people don’t have the stomach to commit to this. So my advice would just be: GET OUT!

A civil war will be unleashed, but the world can do no other thing than contain it and hope for the best. Removal of Saddam Hussein has destabilized the country and no new equilibrium will be found anytime soon.

Johan in Amsterdam, Netherlands | Wednesday, May 02 at 10:12 AM

I guess Van Gogh was safe in the Netherlands.

Jay | Wednesday, May 02 at 11:21 AM

This is an excellent ad, PLEASE MAKE MORE LIKE IT

Dan | Wednesday, May 02 at 11:44 AM

to: Justice is Blind in Both Eyes
“we are fighting tooth and nail to prevent Christian extremism from taking ove our government.”

Sorry, but Justice is Blind, you too are blind. You and Rosie O’Donnell cannot possibly compare Christian extremists to Muslim extremists. And there are some people of ALL faiths that take their beliefs to the extreme. What you said sounds like the brainwashing pap of leftist liberals. There is a difference between liberals and leftist liberals. Just as there is a difference between conservatives and right wing conservatives. All of this labeling is no good for the country. Right now, America’s biggest problem is Americans that handcuff our soldiers and prevent them from fighting a war. There is no such thing as a politically correct war. I cannot imagine what would have happened in WW2 if we didn’t fight with every ounce of strength. No I can imagine….it was called Viet Nam. Politicians worried about being reelected fought the war instead of the generals. I want Gen. Petraeus to kick insurgents butt. Then and only then can we leave with our heads held high and know that we did the right thing. Bleeding hearts be damned.Let our soldiers soldier.

mary m in greenwood, SC | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:13 PM

The Military JUST Vetoed the truth. read on.

The end of military blogs?

“The U.S. Army has ordered soldiers to stop posting to blogs or sending personal e-mail messages, without first clearing the content with a superior officer, Wired News has learned. The directive, issued April 19, is the sharpest restriction on troops’ online activities since the start of the Iraq war. And it could mean the end of military blogs, observers say.”  10:32 am | Comment (71)
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/02/the-end-of-military-blogs/

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:25 PM

First of all, I’ll support the troops when they stand up to this tyrant and tell him, ‘hell no, we won’t go!’

You may need to delude yourself that you’re ‘fighting for our freedoms’ but I fail to see how killing a million innocent people who are simply resisting an invasion and grabbing of their national resources is protecting anyone’s freedom. 

Secondly, if the Smirking Chimp REALLY wanted to protect the US from another 9-11 style attack, they’d be guarding the ports and our porous borders. 

They’re not because THAT wouldn’t serve their greedy interests.  This war is about OIL, it always has been.  Witness our glorious leaders declaring that ‘Iraq would pay for its own reconstruction with oil profits’.  How’d we feel if, say, Australia invaded us, killed a million people, bombed every city and declared we could pay for our own reconstruction with Ford F-150s, Iowa corn and McDonald hamburgers?

9-11 was an inside job, orchestrated by the highest levels of our government as an excuse for ALL that’s come since.  The Orwellian-named Patriot Act (which was written BEFORE 9-11!), the suspension of Habeas Corpus, on and on.  This is ‘protecting our freedoms’?

Buildings don’t turn into micronized dust in mid air (from gravity and fire???)

When the lied-to about the safety-of breathing-the-air rescuers (another Bush lie) started sifting thru the rubble, they found not ONE desk, not ONE room divider, not ONE phone, not ONE computer.  Everything except the steel beams was turned into dust.  Would gravity do that?  Isolated fire?

If even one part of the fantasy of 9-11 and the ‘official story’ is a lie, then it all falls apart, doesn’t it?

Open your eyes people.  Things are far worse than they appear, the US government has been co-opted by the most evil team ever assembled.  These guys make Hitler and Goebbels look like amateurs.

We have an insane and sadistic Caligula as president, Mussolini as vice-president, and Machiavelli as Caligula’s advisor.

What they have done, starting in 2000 with stealing the presidency, is TREASON.  It’s still a hanging offense.

And only another American Revolution will restore anything resembling what this country can be.

And to those of you who are reading this and foaming at the mouth, read “Crossing the Rubicon”, and anything by David Ray Griffin before you start disagreeing with me. 

I’m tired of the idiots running this country (who brag about never reading a book or a newspaper) and the other idiots who support them.  Hitler had his supporters too.  History has condemned them.

signalfire in Portland, Oregon | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:31 PM

In WW2, all communication in and out of European and Pacific chapters was censored. All communication. As a matter of fact, “Loose Lips Sink Ships” was a war slogan. People can inadvertently, without malice or intent, reveal information that the enemy can use to it’s benefit. Is this vetoing the truth? Or erring on the side of caution and safety? Does Al Qaeda have blogs?

mary m in greenwood, SC | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:31 PM

So Why Defend YOUR Freedumbs?
I don,t AND won,t Have to Anymore.
Your FREEDUMBS are NOT worth DEFENDING.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:39 PM

Think long and hard about what you are saying Mary m.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:41 PM

P.S. Mary , I,m AM retired Mil.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:42 PM

Mary M. you sound hateful toward something. what is it?
spell it out girl.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:53 PM

Signalfire
When you start with inside job babble like Rosie O, you damage your position,
What 1,0000,000 people.

Re: the effect of fire, did you happen to see what happen to the highway bridge in San Franciso when a gasoline tank truck caught fire
under it?
Speaking of reading, even Popular Mechanic (hardly a RNC mouthpiece)  debunked your explosives theory.
Here Read it your self
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html

Jay | Wednesday, May 02 at 12:59 PM

Jay. P.M. takes you to Debunking 911 myths.
where is the Re: the effect of fire, did you happen to see what happen to the highway bridge in San Franciso when a gasoline tank truck caught fire
under it?
part?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:13 PM

Jay , another question. from whgat i understood, the towers stood up for aover a full hour before collapsing strasiight downward.
now , from what i heard, heat in elevator shafts caused them to come down.
question is, why were not the people in side fried in that hour?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:15 PM

also, the explosion occurred on top.
not underneath?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:19 PM

and why is p.m. trying to debunk what it calls a myth?
i thought they were into popular mechanics, not investigative reporting.
whats in it for p.m.?
to debunk myths? money?
selling?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:22 PM

CER,

I have read the Popular Mechanics article, it’s a joke.

The 1 million people are the number (estimated because OUR military doesn’t count Iraqi deaths) of Iraqis dead since we invaded.  Women, children, babies, old people.

Sorry to disturb your world view, but you can’t compare a melted bridge (mostly asphalt, a hydrocarbon, melted by several thousand gallons of burning hydrocarbons) with two 110 story buildings.

For those of you who say, ‘the planes did it’, please explain Building 7.
If you’ve even heard of it.  Your collective ignorance is overwhelming.

There were powerdowns in the Twin Towers in the weeks before 9-11.  Supposedly, it was to ‘run new cabling’ into the building.

The contractors who ‘ran the new cabling’ have never been identified.  Seems like a simple matter for the Port Authority to come up with the contractor and the purchase order for the work.  Where is it?  Who did the work? Why did they need to ‘power down the buildings’ and turn off the security cameras? 

It goes on and on and on.  Welcome to the Fourth Reich.

signalfire in Portland, Oregon | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:39 PM

Also Jay, Heat travels up. not down.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:43 PM

The explosion occurred on top. the heat must have traveled up from there.
unless there were explosion underneath like p.m. points out.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:45 PM

and Jay, my mos was 94b. now 92g.
that should tell you something about me.
not the college educated private eye by a long means.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:54 PM

Kerosene obeys the law of gravity and falls downward, and for signal fire WTC 7 was covered in the PM article and it was not PM doing the research , they were reporting on the book “Debunking 9/11 Myths”, not doing the research.
Re: the bridge, much of the support for bridges is from the rebar (steel bars reinforcing the concrete),and it looks like the steel got weak enough to collapse. It does not have to melt just weaken.

Too much credit is given to the CIA and the government. If all those people had really been involved, some body would have sold their story to the National Inquirer.

Jay | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:13 PM

I want to thank you for the great job you did on your ad.

Thank you for this blog as well. It does give people a chance to voice their opinions.

I believe the conservatives have learned how to use and manipulate the mainstream media. You are countering this by beginning to produce ads that represent my opinion - of which I’ve seen too few.

Drew in iowa city, iowa | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:13 PM

Jay, when the planes hit. didn,t they explode? wouldn,t the kerosene(jp8) evaporate?
and even if the kerosene did not evaporate, how did the kerosene find its way to just the elevator shafts and not through the collision areas.
come on Jay. be sensible.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:20 PM

and Jay, kerosene was on fire?
did it take the kerosene a full hour to get to the bottom of those huge towers?
also, Jay, Was the kerosene hot?
read above about why the people didn,t fry.cook to death

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:23 PM

Jay, there was no heat. just explosions.
heat was up on top.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:24 PM

sfc
MOS told me enuf,

and
signalfire
it obvious you did not read the article or toatlly disregarded it. It addressed WTC 7.

When a car burns after a wreck, is it just the gasoline? Nope, it’s upholstery, tires, etc. Thos buildings were not just concrete. The buildings had paneling ( Probably cherry or walnut), furniture, lots of carpet, paper. All of those things burn too.

jay | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:26 PM

I do not think the kerosene   evaporates rapidly. I used it in VietNam to heat C-rations. It burned very hot but would not evaporate unless you turned the container over.

Jay | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:30 PM

Well then Jay. You are a Fool.
your kind are not worth defending.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:30 PM

its no wonder officers got killed alot by so called friendly fire over in nam.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:32 PM

Shiny boots. pffff

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:33 PM

It burned very hot but would not evaporate unless you turned the container over.
no bells going off yet Jay?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:00 PM

Jay, there was no heat. just explosions.
heat was up on top.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 01:24 PM

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:25 PM

unless you turned it over, but then…

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:25 PM

Evaporate as in open air not elevator shafts, don’t like being called a fool by “food service”.

What is the shiny boots pfft,
supposed to mean, For the record I either wore jungle boots or Cochrans, depending on what I was doing.

I defended your rights before you joined, probably while you were in mid school.

I was trying to have a fun discussion but everyone seems to get their BVD’s in a wad when they are challenged.

Afternoon all.
It’s been “Verry interesting” as Arte Johnson used to say.

Jay | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:26 PM

rights?
no Jay, you were defending Your Rights. not mine.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:27 PM

re:

rear echelon mother’s friend=remf

Some one who acts like he’s still in the states in the middle of a combat zone.

Spit shined desert boots smile in the Green Zone in Baghdad would be an example.

Jay | Tuesday, May 01 at 06:14 PM
Fun?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:31 PM

Fun Discussion?
we are at war.
whats fun?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:32 PM

I was trying to have a fun discussion but everyone seems to get their BVD’s in a wad when they are challenged.
hhmmm, very telling.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:36 PM

Dear Garcia:
In a constitutional democracy like ours, the ultimate deciders are the people. The President and Congress work for the people, not the other way around. The American people, through their elected representatives, have decided that they do not support the mission in Iraq and want it to end as soon as possible. You men and women in uniform have our support. The Iraq mission does not. I have a son in the military, and of course I support him. He does not support the Iraq mission either. Note that the American people do support, as I do, the mission in Afghanistan, which is fully justified. The war in Iraq was based on lies and the will of a handful of neocons. Iraq was never a threat to the U.S.
The rest of us want nothing to do with it, and we don’t want our men and women in uniform to die for this mission. The President’s duty, and yours, is one only: to follow the will of the American people, and abort this unjustified mission. Period.

Lucio in Chicago, IL | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:50 PM

Jay,
You are starting to sound like this fella:
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/02/thompson-iraq-moveon/

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 04:09 PM

I dislike war as much as the next American but, what you people are suggesting makes me sick. Lets say we do pull out and all the soilders come home, thank god. THEN WHAT? Are we to just leave that region of the world to further tear itself apart. The economic fallout will become more than most Americans can bare. I suggest that you arrogant flappy jawed ignoramuses come up with a feasible solution before you criticize what is going on.

L Dunavan in Louisville Kentucky | Wednesday, May 02 at 04:18 PM

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud

Actually, you kind of sound like you have a bone to pick with everyone too. Congratulations on being retired military. My husband survived (and not all in one piece) the first SNAFU run by politicians called the Korean “Conflict”. Maybe that is where my anger comes from. People should let the military do their job. Now, what’s your complaint? That 9/11 was an inside job? What a joke. No one in our govt. can keep a secret for more than 10 seconds. It would be on the front of every paper quoting “an anonymous” source aka. spineless squealer. Not an inside job. No one can explain how it happened because it has never happened before. When is the last time jumbo jets, loaded with fuel have actually, physically crashed into a building? Highway just collapsed in CA. from fire. How often does that happen. And as for you “having fun” I haven’t seen one of your posts indicating that. Cop out.

mary m in greenwood, SC | Wednesday, May 02 at 04:47 PM

I’m tired of hearing this word ““success”“. What is success???? We went there ONLY to disarm WMD. Then there were NONE. So COME HOME NOW. PERIOD.

Mike in South Carolina The UNITED States | Wednesday, May 02 at 05:02 PM

Okay,

Just to change the tone for a moment.

What are they hoping to accomplish in Iraq? Also, what would be reasonable amount of time to accomplish that goal, given we’ve been there for 4 years….

Any thoughts?

BC in San Francisco | Wednesday, May 02 at 05:06 PM

Anyone who thinks Bush is doing a good job is silly crazy.

I was for military intervention in Afghanistan.  I still am.

I was dead set against it in Iraq. I still am.

People want to blame Clinton for the problem in Iraq.  Why not Bush, Sr and Dick Cheney.  They blew up Iraq and walked away.  Is that why the neo-conservatives are so gung-ho about finishing today?  Guilty conscience?

Replace Bush.  He’s truly an incompetent fool.  So stubborn he thinks that a compromise is when someone gives up part of what they want and he stays firm.  That must be a Christian thing.

So stubborn people are dying.
So stubborn he’s letting people loot the treasury
So stubborn little kids are losing parents
So stubborn he’s ruining America

Iraq isn’t lost.  It’s just not to be won.  The people there won’t let it be.

Kevin in Boston | Wednesday, May 02 at 06:35 PM

mary m in greenwood, SC | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:47 PM
I didn,t say I was having FUN.
that was Jay.
What is cop out?
are you a cop?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 06:45 PM

mary m in greenwood, SC | Wednesday, May 02 at 03:47 PM
You do however realize that China won the Korean War(conflict), dont you?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 06:46 PM

Mary in Greenwood,

You give yourself away when you call someone who would report what they knew about government complicity as a ‘spineless squealer’.  How much courage would it take for someone who knew a part of what may have really happened that day, to come forward?  And be called a traitor, a coward, a tin foil hat nut job?  And have his family ‘disappear’?

How does one convince someone who’s mind is closed?  You can’t.  You can only point out that Bush and Co. fought ANY investigation as to what happened that day for 15 MONTHS!! Then, when they had to bow to public opinion and pressure from the victim’s families, they tried to appoint Kissinger as head of the committee.  Kissinger, who has been called a war criminal in several countries…

When that was strenuously objected to, they picked another Bush compatriot, Zelikow (who wrote a book with Condoleezza Rice…)

Wouldn’t you think since ‘nothing like that has ever happened before’ they would WANT to know exactly what happened, so as to not build skyscrapers like THAT anymore?  To learn exactly how people with boxcutters could possibly commandeer four jetliners on the same day?  To know how it was possible to confound the most expensive and technologically advanced military the world has ever seen?  To figure out, how, in all that is holy, the PENTAGON, the most protected building on the planet, was itself BOMBED???
Intriguing puzzle, is it not?  Gee, you woulda thought there was anti-aircraft missles on top of the Pentagon.  You would think that if we have spy satellites that can read license plates, we could track planes that have their transponders turned off (the flight that hit the Pentagon ‘disappeared’ off radar.  Please tell me how that happens…)

There are so many mysteries, so many questions unanswered.  I’m sorry, but, ‘go away, you’re a nut case’ doesn’t begin to answer the questions raised from that day.  Thousands of Americans have died, hundreds of thousands of Iraqis.  The US is in far more danger now than it was 6 years ago.  Not to mention, bankrupt. You see, we’re borrowing the money to run our military from China and Japan. And they’re wising up and are not going to be buying our bonds for much longer. And then this whole house of cards is going to fall down. And you’ll wonder what happened to ‘your great country….’

To BC in San Francisco:
The ‘goal’ in Iraq was to establish permanent bases in the Middle East, to sit on the oil (second largest stockpile in the world, outside of Saudi Arabia), wait for peak oil to hit and fully come into play, and then make out like bandits on oil at 200, 300, 400 dollars a barrel.  And rising. There is no intention of ever leaving Iraq, (they’d grab Iran too, but god forbid, they want atomic weapons!!!!) and Saddam Hussein was just another in a long line of excuses to invade.  We supported him until we wanted to use him as a patsy.
Who do you think sold him the chemicals he used to gas the Kurds? We did…

I wish everyone would stop parroting mindless patriotic platitudes, and instead LEARN exactly what kind of government you’re extolling as ‘the best ever’.

signalfire in Portland, Oregon | Wednesday, May 02 at 06:50 PM

I wish everyone would stop parroting mindless patriotic platitudes, and instead LEARN exactly what kind of government you’re extolling as ‘the best ever’.

signalfire in Portland, Oregon | Wednesday, May 02 at 05:50 PM
HAU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 07:15 PM

Not Jay: “I was trying to have a fun discussion but everyone seems to get their BVD’s in a wad when they are challenged.
hhmmm, very telling.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 02 at 02:36 PM”

It was Americas to lose, not Chinas to win. We stopped, not them.

No, a spineless squealer is someone who remains anonymous. Stand up. If you are going to say something that is explosive, then stand up. Don’t hide behind anonymity. Yes it takes courage.

And this is all so futile. And the problem with everything right now. The dividing lines. No compromise. No blending. No nothing. It is sad. I am done here.

mary m in greenwood, SC | Wednesday, May 02 at 10:00 PM

im·peachment n.
Usage Note: When an irate citizen demands that a disfavored public official be impeached, the citizen clearly intends for the official to be removed from office. This popular use of impeach as a synonym of “throw out” (even if by due process) does not accord with the legal meaning of the word

Sherry C. in CT | Wednesday, May 02 at 10:27 PM

Oh, I don’t want them impeached…

I WANT THEM HUNG AS THE TRAITORS THEY ARE.  AND LEAVE THE BODIES UP THERE ROTTING AS AN EXAMPLE TO ALL THOSE WHO WOULD SPIT ON THE CONSTITUTION AND LIE TO THEIR COUNTRYMEN AND COMMIT MASS MURDER AND CALL IT ‘FIGHTING FOR OUR FREEDOMS’.

There are only a few people in Congress who are not complicit, who did not vote for this unholy war.  The rest are criminals, as surely as the Nazis were.  THAT’s why impeachment is ‘off the table’.  They KNOW that if things start getting investigated, we’ll all find out just how much money has changed hands, who was bought off, and who got filthy rich on this war.

signalfire in Portland, Oregon | Wednesday, May 02 at 11:24 PM

To Christopher Edison Rud:  You sir, come across as a charletan and a fraud.  If you actually did serve in the military for as long as you claim, how did you get through it without being found out for the disgrace to the uniform that you are?  Someone, somehow, would have discovered your hatred for your own country and your hatred of the Armed Forces, and drummed you out of there.  There’s simply no way you could have lasted 20 years in the company of true patriotic Americans.

What were you in it for?  Scholarship money?  Or merely a retirement income?  You certainly weren’t in it for mere service to your country.  It must have been truly difficult for you to hide your hatred for yourself and your country for all that time, while you were outwardly smiling and saluting the flag of the United States.  I think they have a name for that kind of behavior…it’s called psychopathic.

Cary Nickel | Thursday, May 03 at 12:11 AM

“The Iraq War was being planned during Bush’s inauguration. You can see the video on the BBC site at Secret Plans for Iraq’s Oil***.  The reasons to go to war on Iraq that Bush told America and the world are false.  Occupying Iraq for Oil and world domination is not working, morally wrong, unjust and illegal.”

***BBC NEWS | Programmes | Newsnight | Secret US plans for Iraq’s oil
The industry-favoured plan was pushed aside by a secret plan, drafted just before the invasion in 2003, ... VIDEO AND AUDIO NEWS. US plans for Iraq oil ...
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/newsnight/4354269.stm - 45k -

Sue S. in Springfield, Missouri, USA | Thursday, May 03 at 01:37 AM

To Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 02 at 11:11 PM
Women tend to think of me as that.Woman.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 06:19 AM

RE: oh Cary Nickel .
Who said I was Smiling?
you don,t have to smile to salute.
yes, i did it for the money. please do tell. who didn,t?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 06:31 AM

Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 02 at 11:11 PM
You certainly weren’t in it for mere service to your country.
you certainly got that one right.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 06:34 AM

You sir, come across as a charletan and a fraud. 
Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 02 at 11:11 PM
And You maam, come across as a drunken hatefull B^tch.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 06:53 AM

Cary Nickel |
Now you know WHY I would NEVER EVER Fight for YOUR FREEDOMS!
Because YOU DONT DESERVE ANY!
POINT MADE!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 07:14 AM

I’m back, but just to discuss Signalfire’s apparent lack of knowledge concerning Air Traffic Control.

There are places in the US where there is no radar coverage by ATC below certain altitudes. The aircraft are separated by distance and altitude. In other places If the transponder is off, the return is very difficult to see and can merge with ground clutter and weather. (PS: Spy satellites usually look at slow moving objects)

Jay | Thursday, May 03 at 07:40 AM

CER

Why the future tense in stead of past tense?

“Cary Nickel |
Now you know WHY I would NEVER EVER Fight for YOUR FREEDOMS!
Because YOU DONT DESERVE ANY!
POINT MADE!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud “

Just curious.

Jay | Thursday, May 03 at 07:42 AM

Jay
unfortunately for HER, i allready did the past tense.
comeon Jay, couldn,t you figure that out allready?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 07:51 AM

I figured it out when you posted it. You phrased in the the future “would never” not “did not” Just being picky about grammar. Like some one else was about the way I expressed my self.

Jay | Thursday, May 03 at 08:06 AM

too sha

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 08:53 AM

But Jay. thats what I mean,t .
would never do it again.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 08:54 AM

Jay,
oh I get. You,re just trying to be funny(having fun) Again?ha   ha

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 09:36 AM

Actually, Rud, I don’t believe you ever did, or ever would have, fought for anyone’s freedom, including your own.  I picture you as one of the “cut and run” crowd, and I believe your “cut and run” behaviour would have manifested itself first on the battlefield.

And if you actually spent 20 years in the military simply for the money, as you claim, then you have even further indicated your stupidity.  You could have made a lot more money in the private sector, and not had to be a phony.

Personally, anyone can be anything they want to be on these blogs.  I have the distinct feeling the way you title yourself is a complete untruth.  Perhaps your father (though I would hate to think you would disgrace your father’s name in such a way)?  Or did you just pick that title and name out of thin air?

I have never met an actual military person with the poor opinion you display toward fellow military people.  And a career military person displaying such contempt is nearly unheard of.  You must really feel you gotten short changed.  I’m sorry you made such terrible choices in your life.  Hopefully, you still have time to turn it around.  I would hate to think you would spend your remaining days feeling such bitterness.

This topic has been beaten to death.  Now it’s time to for congress to quit it’s grandstanding, and to move onto a sensible military spending bill that actually supports the troops overseas and allows for the fighting of this war the way the Commander in Chief and the Generals on ground want it fought.  Period.  End of story.

Cary Nickel in Farmington, New Mexico, USA | Thursday, May 03 at 09:57 AM

And you Cary, Are a Stupid Bitch from Hell. Care to see my DD214?
or, do you even know what that is?
Whore from hell, thats you.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 10:05 AM

Now thats END OF STORY.
Slut.
Go defend Your own FreeDumbs.
Maybe you will be Killed in the Process.
with any luck for society

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 10:06 AM

Go back to your bed and make yourself some more of that prostitution money that you don,t pay taxes on Cary

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 10:09 AM

CER

No fun, very serious, wrong word used when I said “fun”
Challenging yes, thought provoking yes. 
One more question, are you ticked you never made MSGT?

Jay | Thursday, May 03 at 10:15 AM

I,m ticked, yes. did you read my posts above?
but not because i didn,t make E-8.
They sent my Daughter to WAR.
Thank God she made it. and now is out.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 10:20 AM

That will never happen again.
Question for Cary. ever consider signing up?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 10:21 AM

Jay, Cary attacked me first.
has nothing to do with you.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 10:22 AM

CED
I understand the personal aspect.
I have 2 sons, 1 Air Force,
1 Army (in Iraq) and yes I will be happy when he gets home.

Then we can agree to disagree and perhaps anyfourther discussion can be that versus attacks.

Jay | Thursday, May 03 at 10:29 AM

hopefully.
i,m off for a while.
bye

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 10:39 AM

what is our purpose in life? to fight against others for what?... oil,money,their freedom not ours. after “accomplishing” the first mission, i believe we should of never stayed in irak. how did the war start in the first place, with what purpose? is it the same purpose we’re carrying on as we speak? defend our country, YES!... but defend it when we should, not by fighting other countries’ civil war.

Joan | Thursday, May 03 at 11:53 AM

A War without end is not a war.
To the military who want the money I say we want to give it to you to protect you. you only see the republican side of the coin. Please read the bill that congress wrote and then you will see it is the president you should yell at to get your money.
Congress gave you plenty of money but the president vetoed it because it includes an agenda for America. 1 that gives Aid to Hurricane Katrina victims and to children whose health care is about to expire. The only thing he didn’t like was what I just mentioned plus the fact we want to set a timetable for Iraq to meet.
I highly respect all of you in service for us but you are wasting our money. Gas prices are $3.30 a gallon because of the continued instability over in Iraq. Let the Oil companies say what they will but that is the cold hard truth. War raises instability in the commodities markets. We americans are struggling to survive while you fight an endless struggle overseas.

Please understand you have my full support but I want you to know the truth. I’ve read the bill. I’ve seen the bill which anyone can see by visiting congressional websites.

WE WANT YOU FUNDED MAKE NO MISTAKE ABOUT THAT! WE JUST WANT IT DONE THE RIGHT WAY!

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Thursday, May 03 at 01:20 PM

I saw the ad and came here but still dont understand what we can do at this point untill the next election. Please let me know I would like to see something done.  The Bush administration does not seem to put American or Iraqi lives before economic gain.  Losing both in convoys guarding overpriced food is a travesty. I enlisted to make a difference in Afghanistan, N. Korea, Africa. Wherever the weak want us and need us to make a difference.  If I am deployed to Iraq I will go willingly to help protect my fellow Americans there but will vocally be opposed to the Bush greed and policy.
  Take this warning. We will be in Iraq for years unless we vote against tyranny instead of sitting silent.  There have already been plans for deployments to OIF in 2009.

S.A.D | Thursday, May 03 at 02:39 PM

Why doesn’t anyone mention the fact that this was is illegal?  King George will do as he pleases and there is absolutely nothing any of us can do about it but complain.  Thank God he will be voted out.  That is our only consolation, if we try to impeach him, the cost would be extrodinary, not to mention that nothing would get done from here on out, and if we got him out then who Cheney??? God forbid.  Sadly there is nothing we can do, there isn’t even anything the new house and senate can do, As long as King George is in office he will do exactly what he wants no matter what anyone tells him.  He hasn’t listened to one word from anyone about anything, and that doesn’t mean just this horrible war, how about the global warming issue that he thinks is a farce?  HELP!!!  We all know he’s an idiot but then how did he get in to begin with?  Thank you Repulican party.

angryhousewife in Glendale, Ca | Thursday, May 03 at 02:54 PM

I felt like the wind had been knocked out of me when the sheeple voted that idiot into office for a SECOND term!

If the US (mis)Government had not gone on the offensive and tried to impart their beliefs on everyone else, we wouldn’ be in this mess, nor would we be considered such arrogant assholes by the rest of the free world.

BC in San Francisco | Thursday, May 03 at 03:09 PM

To the one who mentioned this war being illegal you are right and the time will come when both not just bush when both bush and cheney will be brought before a war crimes tribunal but before that can happen the war must end and most likely in 2009 when the next president takes office. For those who don’t know when the next president takes office it is at High noon on January 20, 2009 by decree of the United States Constitution it will always be high noon on January 20th the year any president takes office. The constitution also decrees no president can be in office no longer than 8 years total. President Bush has used 6 as of January 20, 2007.
January 20, 2008 will be 7 and he reaches the end of his eighth year at high noon on January 20, 2009.
As for the other person who asked what they could do. You said you saw the video. The Video has a number you can call with your comments. Also call your local senators or reps and tell them how you feel. they will do battle for you and are already doing battle on the democratic side and there are also 2 republicans doing battle with the democrats against the rest of the republicans. The more the number of republicans on our side goes up the stronger change we have of overriding future vetoes from him.
Don’t give up. I read somewhere that it took 73 votes in congress to end the vietnam war. We’ve only had 1.
The battle is far from over in congress probably and will probably take patience.

Robert | Thursday, May 03 at 04:23 PM

Sorry Robert. but it is to late.
once freedom has been given…..
think about this one now…......
IT CAN NOT BE TAKEN AWAY….........
America IS this place…..
16   And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/revelation_16.html
BUT, here is what we CAN do.
4   And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/revelation_18.html

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 07:49 PM

there is your truth.
sorry

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 03 at 07:50 PM

I said I was done here, but I decided to come back and reread all of the posts on this topic and I did. What I observed has nothing to do with veterans, or liberals or conservatives or neocons or pacifists or any other labels that we so freely paste on people. What I see are a lot of posts by people, self included, that seemed to enjoy and thrive on negativism. I don’t think I saw one post that came up with any solutions - and impeachment does not count. And this, my fellow Americans, seems to be the problem with ALL of our candidates. It is easy to point fingers, place blame and Monday morning quarterback when no one is holding you to any form of responsibility. I am also tired of the Speaker of the House telling me that all Americans voted to end the war. Not necessarily. No one in their right mind WANTS to continue a war. However, I think this past election was about much more than that. It was about irresponsible, pedophiliac, pork barrel, self-centered congresspersons who had a free pass for far too long. So, it is time for all of us to step up to the plate and have real dialogue now. To drop the hatreds, I told you so’s, etc. etc. ad nauseum.  It is time to come up with a solution beyond pulling out of Iraq. Because as we know, this war was not planned well. Our soldiers fought well, almost too good and preparations were not considered for After the Fall. So, rather than using all of our energies on hatred, we should be working together, using our collective intellect and bail our useless politicians of both parties out of this mess. It will take time. But it must be done properly. Stop hating, start working.

mary in greenwood, SC | Thursday, May 03 at 10:14 PM

One more thing. People who didn’t vote for Bush would serve everyone better by not continually patting yourselves on the back. That is all that Bush Bashing is. Aren’t I smart? You big dummies voted for him. It is very transparent . Get over it, it is getting old. Even Al Gore found a new project and guess what?  I think he is doing more good now, than he could have done from the contraints and restrictions of the Oval Office.

mary in greenwood, SC | Thursday, May 03 at 10:23 PM

Sorry Mary. You are very judgemental and speak before you know the truth because if you had asked at least me don’t know about the others and I’ll be happy to show you my voter status.
I’m a registered democrat and not proud of that either.
I voted for Al Gore in both 2000 and 2004. Don’t tell me I voted for Bush cause I didn’t and I can prove it!
Now someone mentioned negativity being a problem here and though what have just said was negative what follows will not be negative cause I try not to be a negative person.
Here’s a perspective I see that is a good idea. Sam Waterston of TV’s long running show Law And Order has a website but since I don’t know if I advetising is allowed here I can’t give you the address but I’ll tell you that his Idea is called Unity08 and it is meant to put a democrat in as President and a republican in as Vice President that way there is a chance to work together to resolve conflicts. This is an idea I support but it truly must be unified. A ticket needs to be created that we all can agree on but until then
It’s time to put our country back in Order and the democrats and 2 republicans have joined forces to do so. I will leave things at that. There is no negativity in that just facts.
Here’s hoping that we all do learn to get along but the time has come to leave Iraq.
For those who believe the war in Iraq is still hopeful I guess you don’t pay attention to the facts because I just heard that parliament in Iraq that we are giving time to get organized is gonna take a long Summer Break! A Break! BREAK!
What kind of parliament is this?
This is what we keep our troops in Iraq for is so Al Maliki and his government can take a nice long vacation to somewhere far away?
Sorry But this is Same old stuff just a different day Bush Fanatics.
WAKE UP!

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Friday, May 04 at 12:03 AM

Post Correction:

In my previous post I stated that I voted for Al Gore In 2000 and 2004.

Here’s the correction:
I voted for Al Gore only in 2000.
Gore did not run in 2004 so I voted for the democrat who did and I will admit he flip flopped but I didn’t support Bush won’t support Bush Can’t Support Bush Ain’t gonna Support Bush. I voted for John Kerry in 2004.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Friday, May 04 at 12:08 AM

Mary,

I just caught your post on Ms. Pelosi.
You have the right to bash her if you want but if you choose to do so I will defend her.
First off you mention not everyone in America voted to end the war that is true.
But you know who did?
Oh…Hmmm…Let me see now…
I know…
Democrats…
The ones who had no say for way too long and now that they do you republicans can’t stand it.
well guess what we the people awake and in our right mind who haven’t been brainwashed or if you haven’t been brainwashed then I guess the term would be uneducated have spoken and said Get Out Of Iraq.
  By the way Ms. Pelosi never agreed to drop the timetables.
There will be very little room for compromise with the great divide between our speaker and your president. There is a great divide.
We all have freedom of speech.
I promise you I won’t put you down again If you promise to stop putting the dems down.
You are very opinionated and I will admit so am I.
The time for insults is over.
The time for an unending war is over.
The time for wasting American’s money is over.
The time for domestic spending being spent on Iraq is over.
America is going into the depths of despair and Bush remains so focused on the war that he just doesn’t care about anything except that war.
These are the facts.
Infecting truth is important.

  This is the truth.

America has sacrificed too much
Been Patient too long.

I am only trying to show the facts and hope that maybe just maybe sometime soon we the democrats and you the republicans can bridge that great divide but right now we hugely disagree.

Let the opinions go on.
Let the discussion go on.
But enough with the put downs.
I’ve put my last bit of argument, put downs whatever you want to call it into this e-mail and hope this will be the last time I have to do so.

Hopefully we can now have a peaceful discussion without further put downs although I understand if you want to bash me for basing you in this e-mail but I don’t consider it bashing I consider it defending Ms. Pelosi because you put her down.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Friday, May 04 at 12:23 AM

Bridging The Gap Part 1

Understanding Each Other’s Point of View.
I have an idea. I think to start to bridge that gap. Maybe we should discuss the differences and then individually explain the points.

I’ll start.

Point #1 Bush Goes To the U.N. approx. (2003)

Here is the first argument I have against this war in the first place
Circa 2003 President Bush went before the United Nations to get backing for the war in Iraq.
When they wouldn’t give it to him he decided to go it alone.

Example #1 of I’m The Decider!

Please share your thoughts with me on this particular portion of what has happened since 9-11.

Personally I feel it was unwise to enter this war without the backing of the U.N.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Friday, May 04 at 12:32 AM

Cary Nickel! Get off this blog, please. Your posts full of GOP snobbery and your ability to intolerably patronize is astonishing. Go write a boring novel, please, and spare us all. Thank you very much. (Again, is there something in the water in New Mexico - asbestos or something? “Run, Cary, I think you have been poisoned. Save yourself!”)

Puking from pure boredom in The world | Friday, May 04 at 07:06 AM

Personally I feel it was unwise to enter this war ,Period. Reread my posts about going after the 911 terrorists. not go after entire nations. they had OBL. they let him go. no, it never was to go after terrorists. it was a plan to irradicate and change policies in the middleeast. to GIVE them so called Free Dominion.
they(middleeast)Had King Dominion allready set. do you know why king Hussain invade Kuwait? Because Kuwait was tapping into Iraq Oil. without Saddams permission. I admit, you dont start war over Oil. that was wrong, hence, 1st Gulf War. Senior Bush was Wise to stop and draw a parallel line(38 degree line). that line was working. I could go on and on. but, it doesn,t matter much anymore. our freedoms will soon end and God will be back.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 04 at 07:22 AM

Like I said, Bush Himself is a Terrorist.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 04 at 07:35 AM

I admit, you don,t start war over Oil.
Then Again, You don,t STEAL from your neighbors either.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 04 at 10:09 AM

How many Americans have to be killed before you stop this madness.  Bring our troops home now.

Parvine Kia in Rosemead, Ca. | Friday, May 04 at 11:33 AM

RE: Mr. Rud….“THOU SHALT NOT COVET”...(thy neighbor’s oil).

RE: J Wood in NC…It sure would be nice to let the Generals do their job in a purely military fashion.  Too bad the Generals and their itinerary’s have been bought, paid for, and programmed in a purely political fashion by the Monkey boy and his administration.  Somebody shove him a banana.

Hobobob in south carolina | Friday, May 04 at 11:39 AM

Want the truth about your illustrious leaders?  Check out a book called: “Static” by Amy Goodman.

hobobob in south carolina | Friday, May 04 at 11:51 AM

Hobobob in south carolina | Friday, May 04 at 10:39 AM
Actually its:
17   Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour’s.
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/exodus_20.html
close enough what you said though.
(just trying to be a smart a**, don,t take it personally though. I Agree with you).
this is what it says about the poor:
20   ¶ And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God.
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/luke_6.html
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/luke_16.html

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 04 at 12:32 PM

just sayin.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 04 at 12:42 PM

Sorry Robert, you speak before you digest what you have read.

First, I don’t care how you voted. And I didn’t tell you that you voted for Bush. I don’t need to see your voting stub. How juvenile. Nowhere did I say that you voted for Bush. Reread. . What I did say was: ” People who didn’t vote for Bush would serve everyone better by not continually patting yourselves on the back.” You can call that judgmental or just an observation that the predominance of Bush Bashing is carried on by people who state that they did not vote for him in either one or both elections and they are proud that they did not vote for him and they like to keep reminding everyone. Are Ms. Pelosi’s supporter’s Nancy “fanatics”?(to use your word?)

Second I did not bash Ms. Pelosi. I merely stated fact and what she said in her previous press conferences with Sen. Harry Reid. Pay attention to what you read and what you hear….make sure it is not just what you Want to hear or read. She has repeatedly stated that the voters “mandated” a pull out in Iraq and that there be an immediate action to end the war. That is what she says. Look it up. That is not bashing, it is stating fact. If you need a quote I will find one for you. Also, you state “By the way Ms. Pelosi never agreed to drop the timetables. ” No where did I say that she did.  You also state “Hopefully we can now have a peaceful discussion without further put downs although I understand if you want to bash me for basing you in this e-mail but I don’t consider it bashing I consider it defending Ms. Pelosi because you put her down.” No where did I put Ms. Pelosi down. No where. Reread what I wrote.  If you are going to accuse me or anyone of bashing or negativism, the least you can do is thoroughly read what it written and not just make presumptions. Running this country is not and should not be a “nyah-nyah you said this about my candidate, so I can say this about yours”.

Finally, Robert, the only thing that you said that was not defensive or negative was having a two party administration. Which is done in some countries and is actually not a bad idea. However, I am not sure (I would have to look it up) that it wouldn’t require a Constitutional amendment of some kind to change this.

mary in greenwood, SC | Friday, May 04 at 01:03 PM

And here is what it says about the RICH, FREE,ABUNDANTLY,
24   But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.
25   Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep.
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/luke_6.html
the rich man also died, and was buried;
23   And in hell he lift up his eyes,
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/luke_16.html

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 04 at 05:22 PM

As Promised in my previous post I am moving on to a different subject now and would like to know what people think about the subject I am listing today.

The 2008 Election

I was watching the news today and heard that Florida wants 1st rights in the race for the White House and this should come as no surprise.
But here’s what is so disturbing about it.
If Florida gets what it wants all the caucus and Primaries will be forced to move up and according to what I heard this would make the very first primary take place 10 days before Christmas 2007 on December 15, 2007.
This Year! We are starting This Year!
So Here’s the question.
Should Florida be allowed to move up and take 1st rights in this election?
I mean are they not the ones that cheated in 2000 and 2004?

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Friday, May 04 at 05:33 PM

Let the Last be First and the First be Last this time.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 04 at 05:38 PM

Hey Rud:  The last gasp of the liberal mind is name calling.  It is used when there is no rational argument left.  You have illustrated the point perfectly, thank you!

To “Puking..”  It is also a common lib tactic to attempt to stifle opposing viewpoints.  If you’re so bored, please feel free to move on to greener pastures yourself.  I’m having fun here.  Also, feel free to skip over my stuff…you aren’t forced to read it.  This is s free country.

If one really wants to make the conversation interesting, how about this:

Every thinking person knows the Iraq war is not about oil. 

However, why NOT start wars over oil?  Oil is the life-blood of the North American continent.  Oil is a national security issue. 

It is beyond comprehension why the Democrats attempt to stop every attempt to further domestic oil production, forcing us to depend on foreign sources.  Then also castigate us if we have to fight to secure that source as well. 

Al Gore’s limosines and private jets cease to move without oil, just the same as Joe Six-Packs 1995 Ford F-150.

Without oil, the nation stops.  Simple as that.  If anyone posting here has scrapped their automobiles, disconnected their homes from the electric and gas lines, and has refused to buy anything made of plastic, I applaud that person…he or she is walking the walk.

The rest of us are still oil-dependent, and God help this nation if we woke up tommarrow and the TV didn’t work, the refrigerators were warm, and there was no gasoline or diesel to be had down at the filling station.

I’m not saying being this oil dependent is a good thing..but it is how it is.

Cary Nickel | Saturday, May 05 at 06:46 AM

Cary,

This is a page for solutions not arguments. The last statement I made was supposed to move us on from arguing.
Please discontinue the negativity that has turned this page into one argument after another.

I know and admit that I have argued here but the last thing I did was end the fisticuffs not to have them brought back.

I’m not saying get lost like the others are I’m simply saying please stop the bashing and be helpful with Ideas.

And hopefully more of you will be willing to give me your thoughts on earlier primaries.

The subject I introduced yesterday.

Thank you Mr. Rud for your thoughts on the subject. I appreciate someone trying to help me create a peaceful forum here and you are doing that.
Kudos to you.

Oil Dependence:

We are in Iraq for oil. That is why the oil companies are making their profits. If we would get out of Iraq oil profits would die down and the market would stabilize as far as OPEC.
However the war alone is only a small part of the equation.
The oil companies are manipulating the market creating outrageous gas prices.
Congress is doing what they can to pass new laws that the FTC says they will enforce to bring price manipulators to justice.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Saturday, May 05 at 10:30 AM

This page is not about solutions.  It’s about bashing our President, denigrating our military, and questioning our very form of government.  There can be no solutions presented here, because the problems addressed are non-issues based on lies and the tossing around of wild, unsubstantiated charges against our leaders, citizens, and our military men and women overseas.

The fact that you are praising Mr. Rud for his attempts to create a “peaceful” forum here identifies you as squarely in the camp of the haters.  Have you even read anything he has written?  Rud, a peacemaker?  Laughable.

Would you prefer I resort to the profanity and name-calling, as he has?  My comments stand.

Cary Nickel | Saturday, May 05 at 12:43 PM

Robert:1st: “We are in Iraq for oil. That is why the oil companies are making their profits. ” is incorrect. We are not there for oil. If we wanted to fight with our major supplier about oil, we need only to simply line up at the Canadian border. The oil companies are making their profits because we buy their product. From Venezuela and Canada first, before Iraq. This is a capitalist country. Supply and demand. A high school economics class teaches that if there is demand for a product, the price will go up. The American public cannot say no to itself. There is no such thing as self sacrifice anymore. Everyone wants what they want and they want it now. We must look filthy rich at any cost. Gotta have a Hummer or Escalade.
Sorry wrong again on this one:
“The oil companies are manipulating the market creating outrageous gas prices.” The oil companies are not doing this. The speculators on Wall Street are doing this. The oil companies are merely doing what businesses all over the world do and that is sell a product for the highest price that consumers are willing to pay. Even Cabbage Patch Dolls worked the same way.

Finally, Congress is doing what they can to pass new laws that the FTC says they will enforce to bring price manipulators to justice.” Congress is doing squat because they have no testicular fortitude. They will do nothing that might interfere with their meal ticket - whether provided by lobbyists or citizens. They are afraid to do anything for fear that over zealous environmentalists will make a racket, or for fear that a lynch mob will await them if prices soar even more, or for fear they will have to make Detroit automakers get off their duffs and compete with Japan and Korea. Congress is doing nothing and will continue to do so. Just as they did the first time around in 1975 when J. Carter was President.

So what can we do? We CAN say no to ourselves. But we won’t. We are a nation of spoiled people. The Greatest Generation looks at us and shakes their collective head. After all, they created the baby boomers and wanted to give their children everything after WW2. And so on and so on and so on. We can change, but we won’t. Not until our backs are up against the wall - evidently people don’t feel that way now. They did after 9/11, but how soon we forget. It is all tied in together - a National Attitude.

mary in greenwood, SC | Saturday, May 05 at 12:59 PM

Hey Cary
You started with the name calling,.
I Merely finished it.
No, Thank YOU smile

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Saturday, May 05 at 01:03 PM

And don’t even get me started on the “carbon credits”. They were dreamt up by someone who does not like sacrifice….that is why it has gone over so big in Hollywood. Gee, I can still have that Hummer and 12,000 sq. ft. air conditioned mansion and my private jet if I pay someone in a 3rd world country to plant a few hundred trees in my name. These environmental saviors would also be the people that do not want to open up the ANWR (miniscule-look on a map) area in Alaska because the caribou might have to walk under a pipeline or God forbid, gasp, look at one. A country of hypocrites.Okay, ask me….mileage on our vehicles…..nothing under 25 mpg. Heat set at 66 and air conditioning (when used) set at 78. Time for everyone to walk the talk or shut up. Congress will not bail us out, Robert. Look at their chauffeur driven vehicles…how many are hybrids? Only we can help ourselves. If people honestly think that we are in Iraq because of oil and and they think that our soldiers are fighting and dying because of oil, why in the heck are we not able to curtail our usage of it? If people honestly think that oil is the cause of death in Iraq then why do they not have the self sacrifice to stop using as much? If I told you that the car you drove was personally responsible for the death of 9 soldiers and 8 civilians today, would you continue to fill your tank and drive at your pleasure?

mary in greenwood, SC | Saturday, May 05 at 01:46 PM

Hey Rud, I didn’t start any name calling, I called the truth as I see it.  I figured you out for a fraud after reading just a little of your tripe.  If you are going to call my President a terrorist, or denigrate my country, then you are simply wrong, sir.  I will stand up to you, no problem, and your charges will not go unchallenged. 

President Bush is no terrorist.  Far from it.  Thinking people know he didn’t want this war, it was given to him.  The United States is a noble nation.  We do what we can to save the rest of the world from itself.  However misguided.  Personally, if other countries can’t keep their own houses in order, then I say to hell with them.  We shouldn’t be wasting our military lives, or monetary treasure, on saving people who won’t save themselves.

However, when they come to us, and kill our people, then I say “no mercy”.  The problem with Iraq is that we didn’t do enough to show our strength and determination.  If we want solutions here, then we should treat Iraq like a real war, and pull no punches.  If Bush failed, thats where he did.  Not enough military force early on to strike fear into the hearts of every Iraqi.  We thought the Iraqi people would stand up for themselves, and they havn’t.  We cannot leave a mess over there, our national security, and our national honor, is at stake.  Not to mention our commitment to the Iraqi government.  Iraq is a long term strategy, and part of a long term solution, to a problem that has been facing the United States for over 20 years.  President Bush had the “huevos” to face the problem head on.  Let’s just hope our next few Presidents are as far-sighted as this President, or we will be facing middle east crisis for generaions to come. 

Mary in greenwood is far, far closer to truth than most will ever be on this blog.

Cary Nickel | Saturday, May 05 at 03:54 PM

Hey Cary and Mary,

You are on a democratic website.
If you expect to find a fight you are doing a dang good job.

  The GOP is way outdated.
  Never was any good in the first place.
    THE GOP is killing American’s
  1 pocket lining at a time.
  They are filthy rich and care less about us as Americans.

  All they care about is MONEY
  The Bible warned of Money being the root of all evil.

I wish you 2 could see it.

  I’m trying to be friendly and you 2 just seem to want to fight.

  PEACE Cary and Mary PEACE

We have a right to our opinion as do you.

  Just quit being childish about it already.

Quit with the bickering already.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Saturday, May 05 at 06:23 PM

Robert, it is not just the GOP party that is filthy rich. Please take off your blinders. John Kerry and his wife are millionaires ten times over. The Kennedy family? How about supporters of the Dems like Spielberg, Oprah, Streisand et al. George Soros? The Bible states that money is the root of all evil? Really? Better tell ALL of the candidates this as they amass their “war chests”.

Nowhere did I state how I voted either. How can you presume how I voted? There are moderate Democrats too. Please wake up and do not take every observation as a critcism or bickering. You want to talk about things then you have to look at it from all angles and as long as you think that anyone who disagrees with you or the Democratic platform is childish then I feel sorry for you. I am not bickering with you I am making observations and not once, not once did I challenge a specific politician, Democrat or Republican. I said that they were ALL guilty. So Robert, don’t start these “discussions” if you can’t handle people disagreeing with you. No where does it say Democratic Americans United for a Change on this website.  And therein lies the rub. We are all Americans who seem to be going through an ugly divorce.

mary in greenwood, SC | Saturday, May 05 at 07:09 PM

One more thing Robert. Peace to you too. But you gotta mean it. You can’t keep making provocative statements and then wondering why people are arguing with you. Do you need an example? You stated “This is a page for solutions not arguments. The last statement I made was supposed to move us on from arguing.” That was after you stated “Should Florida be allowed to move up and take 1st rights in this election? I mean are they not the ones that cheated in 2000 and 2004?” So you accused a whole state of cheating in two national elections. Cheating is a rather inflamatory word, sir. Accusing people of cheating is like accusing people of horse thievery. Do you not understand that you are the one instigating arguments by the way you pose your questions? And then act totally innocent and pacifistic when people respond to you in kind. You could have just asked if Florida should be allowed to change their date. You didn’t have to add the part about cheating. You sir, are the one stirring the pot. Sorry. You get what you ask for.

mary in greenwood, SC | Saturday, May 05 at 07:39 PM

I will be careful how I phrase things for the sake of showing that I really do care about creating peace here.

I will not say any thing flaming anymore for the sake of peace.

This is for all Americans who want change and I do apologize for accusing you of being republican.

I can admit when I’m wrong Mary but I still don’t feel wrong about Bush.

Only time will reveal the answer about whether Bush is good or not but he seems like a dictator to me.

Please realize I just did use names but that I also used an adjective describing the feeling.

In otherwords I am not calling him a dictator, I am saying that is what his attitude shows him to be.

Maybe he is not, Maybe he is.

I view what I see and when he tells congress No like he did it feels that way.

Please Understand my heart is in the right place.

I am not 1 of the people here trying to stir the pot.

As I said from now on I will try to be careful how I phrase things.

Apologies to All I have offended.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Saturday, May 05 at 09:35 PM

Robert. It is not you Stirring the Pot. It is the Repubs and people like Cary, Mary.
Peace to You Robert.
P.S. I know from Experience about people like Cary/Mary.
They,re up to NO Good.
Just Ignore them.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Sunday, May 06 at 12:14 PM

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud

So you know about people like me. I am up to no good. From 6 posts you are able to lump me into a group? How dare you make a judgement call like that.

As for Robert’s most recent post. It is a good and fair one and I appreciate his effort. I accept his feelings about Pres. Bush. I understand that Robert is not alone in that. However, this time he accurately presented them as feelings though…not as fact. That was all I was asking. And Robert, there is nothing wrong with stirring the pot, it can be a good thing, it brings a lot of impurities to the surface that would otherwise stay on the bottom where no one would see them. Just like a pot of soup. So stir. Go for it. That is what dialogue is all about. It’s just how we do it, that’s all.

I will say this about dictatorship….Hugo Chavez, Castro, Hitler etc. did not give anyone an opportunity to vote over a veto. Our congress has that constitutional ability to do so and could not muster the vote even with a Democratic edge. The oil companies in Venezuela are feeling dictatorship first hand. Chavez next target is the banking industry. Then what industry will he want to take over after that? First socialism, then what? Communism in Venezuela? It is a question to ask because of Chavez close friendship with Castro.

So, (sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud whether I am a Republican or a Democrat is no one’s business but mine and if I choose to tell anyone. For all you know, I could be a Libertarian. Don’t you be telling Robert what to think about anyone. He can and should make up his own mind. All I was asking him to do was consider the weight of his words and he did.

mary in greenwood, SC | Sunday, May 06 at 02:05 PM

The bible says nothing about money being the root of evil…it says that the LOVE of money is the root of evil.

Now, go tell Al Gore to give up his limos and mansions, and tell him to live like he wants the rest of us to live.  Forget his phony “carbon offset credits” that he buys from his own company to make himself feel better about his wanton use of carbon spewing energy, and to try to put one over on the public at large.  I am truly offended by the fact that Gore thinks the American public is that gullible.

While at it, tell the Kennedy’s and Kerry’s to give up all their trappings of wealth as well.  I want to see how much each gave personally to the Katrina effort, or to any other disaster fund.  They are good at giving away the public’s money, but not their own.  See them for the charletans they are.

Gore and Kerry are fakes, make no mistake about it.  Did you know about John Kerry’s re-routing of a natural stream to his ranch in Idaho so he could have more water to keep his lawn green?  He applied for, and got, permission from every federal authority necessary to do so, and applied his Senatorial pressure to get it done. 

Was Kerry the “green” candidate merely because he was able to keep his lawn green? 

I couldn’t support these guys because they do not practice what they preach.  If they are such “fakirs” in their personal vs. public lives, how could I believe anything they have to say?  If I cannot believe the Democratic candidate 100% of the time, and yet believe, and agree with, the GOP candidate 50% of the time, the GOP gets my vote.

As for debate:  Good debate is by nature, argument.  But there are limits.  If one wants to have a decent discussion which presents all points of view, I’m all for it.  But sitting here calling Bush a terrorist, or repeatedly re-visiting the old, worn out, unproven “stolen election” charges, does nothing for the future.  Nor does calling me a “slut” or prostitute as Rud did.  Call me a fraud or fake if you want to, thats opinion I can live with.  Rud’s crossing the line does nothing to support his argument. 

George Bush is my president, and the United States is my country, “warts and all”.  No man is perfect, Bush has made mistakes.  I can accept that and be critical of those mistakes without resorting to wild, baseless charges.  I would still vote for him again because I believe he was the best choice of the two candidates presented.  GOP Platform principles, when actually applied, do work.  It has been proven over and over.  It’s only when GOP politicians sit back, “fat and sassy”, and abandon their principles that we lose our way.

Cary Nickel | Sunday, May 06 at 03:07 PM

“It’s only when GOP politicians sit back, “fat and sassy”, and abandon their principles that we lose our way.”

Not just limited to GOP Cary.

It is all sad. It makes me feel sad to hand this country over to my son and his generation.

I wish I could go back in time. 1950’s post Korea would be kind of nice for some things.

mary in greenwood, SC | Sunday, May 06 at 10:19 PM

Leaving Iraq

Just wanted to say that I feel like Bush is right when it comes to leaving Iraq. The terrorists could follow us home but I also want to say that I feel this war is a lost cause and that even If he stays and tries to improve the situation the day will come when we do leave Iraq and I still don’t see that being a good day.

Bottom Line:
Whether we Leave Iraq now or 20 years from now I think the outcome whatever it be will be the same because we have ticked off too many different terrorist groups.

This is not based on facts it is just the way the world looks right now to me.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Monday, May 07 at 12:09 AM

see what I mean ? they,re just itching for an argument.
and a fight. possibly for more war.
well, mary, cary. go sign up in the military now.
let He OR SHE who are FREE of sin cast the first stones.
america is free,but, NOT free of sin.
I wouldn,t be casting stones if I were living in america girls.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Monday, May 07 at 01:52 AM

Hey Cary and Mary,

You are on a democratic website.
If you expect to find a fight you are doing a dang good job.
Robert in Corvallis, OR | Saturday, May 05 at 05:23 PM
See? Mary, Cary?
I am not the only one lumping.
then, I agree with Robert. You Girls are way off base.
check out the world population.
maybe you,ll learn something.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Monday, May 07 at 02:01 AM

The bible says nothing about money being the root of evil…it says that the LOVE of money is the root of evil.
Cary Nickel | Sunday, May 06 at 02:07 PM
Thats a Lie.
It will be Harder for the rich to enter in to the kingdom of heaven than for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle.
“Jesus”.
24   But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.
25   Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep.
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/luke_6.html
I Take either You Don,t know what a bible is, or you don,t read it.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Monday, May 07 at 02:19 AM

As for You Mary.
How could I NOT lump you into a group after reading This?:
to: Justice is Blind in Both Eyes
“we are fighting tooth and nail to prevent Christian extremism from taking ove our government.”

Sorry, but Justice is Blind, you too are blind.

mary m in greenwood, SC | Wednesday, May 02 at 11:13 AM

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Monday, May 07 at 02:24 AM

Robert,
Isn,t it Sad that this has to even happen?
If they were payed well, maybe they never would have done it. whats your opinion on this ?:
Soldiers among storm looting suspects.
http://rss.cnn.com/~r/rss/cnn_topstories/~3/114674793/index.html

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Monday, May 07 at 02:30 AM

Instead of using common sense or rational thinking, people are writing and speaking in political talking points. It’s become too pervasive in today’s political climate.

I understand people want to believe their president, but Bush and his administration are not telling the truth. Our “liberal” media is not telling the public the complete story either. International news and Iraqi bloggers, actually living in Iraq, combined complete the picture to better grasp what is at stake. It is time consuming, but worthwhile.

Missing from the debate: the human cost.

Bloggers provide the human dimension. Riverbend’s writings describing daily life in Iraq are outstanding. Furthermore they earned her a literary award. Her thoughts and ideas, her feelings and experiences during the four years of US occupation are found on her blog site, Baghdad Burning.

Although Riverbend did not support the invasion, with Saddam no longer in power, she had hope for the future. Unfortunately that hope, over the past four years, dwindled into despair and anger. Her writings reflect the gradual overall change that took place.

Unfortunately she and her family must leave Iraq; it is too dangerous to stay. They are not alone: between 2 - 3 million already left; many will not return and another 1.5 million are displaced within Iraq.

There is a true humanitarian crisis in Iraq taking place and our media is silent except for a mention here or there.

Although Iraqis hopes were short-lived, in comparison to a lifetime of not having hope, must have made it even more difficult to relinquish. But factors such as Abu-Ghraib, torture, mass killings, rapes, violence, corruption, lack of security, unlimited detentions, etc. are not much to hold onto in hope for a better tomorrow especially living with daily violence with no end in sight. Add to the overall picture the stubborn “decider-in-chief” refusing to change course paints a far dimmer picture for their future.

Last adding insult to injury the show of disrespect and disregard for Iraqi lives, their customs, mores and beliefs coupled with the aforesaid it is no surprise their hope turned into anger and rage; It is understandable.

Imagine as an Iraqi living through that hell, to hear the “decider” complaining Iraqis are unappreciative! The gall, hubris and arrogance heard from those words are a perfect example how distanced Bush is from reality. He is responsible for the utter destruction of millions of lives. What he reigned on Iraq, a sovereign country that had nothing to do with 911 nor so-called terrorism, no one should ever be allowed to do again.

Bush’s biggest failure is he never made it about the Iraqi people given that: an estimated 1 million plus have been killed. A year ago, July 2006, the respected and highly regarded Lancet Report reported 655,000 - 850,000. And he fails to take into account their daily struggles requiring immediate health care cannot be fulfilled. For example the lack of medicine and equipment due to the violent occupation rendered Iraq’s hospitals inadequate to treat the alarming rise of cancers among children and other dis_eases.

Americans need to know the effect of the US occupation.

Furthermore equally or more importantly it is necessary for Americans to know the Iraqi people want us out NOW.

There is nothing to win or lose.

This is not a war. We invaded a country and now we are occupying it. It is a bloody and violent occupation.

The Iraqis citizens are fighting us to reclaim their country, their land, their families and their lives. The so called “terrorists” are a handful in number. They fought along side the Sunnis until the Sunnis realized they were killing Iraqis. So the Sunnis are fighting them, the US and the Shiites. The Shiites are fighting the US occupation, the “terrorists” and the Sunnis. And the US is fighting against all of the above.

It is impossible to distinguish who is the enemy. So the US military decided to build walls around neighbourhoods. That’s not the best decision the US military has ever made to say the least!

Understand too that the fighting is not about religion on the most part. The Sunnis and Shiites are fighting for political power and they are fighting the US occupation. It is time to bring our soldiers home. 

This is not about politics this is about life and death.

The Iraqis want us out.

They say our presence fuels the violence.

That being the case we need to leave ASAP.

Last but not least:  There is a great void in the debate:

This is about the Iraqi people; it is about their country; it is about letting them decide their own future; it is not our place to decide what they want. It is about life and death. The choices belong to them.

Will the violence immediately stop if we leave? Probably not, but it will eventually, so the sooner we leave the sooner it ends.

We need to give Iraqis their country back.

Moreover give them their dignity.

These are human beings not political talking points.

serena1313 in dallas, texas | Monday, May 07 at 03:23 AM

mary in greenwood…

Simplisticly stated:

Chavez is not a dictator. He was democratically elected 8 times in a row. His people love him because he gives them hope for tomorrow. He has lifted tens and hundreds of thousands out of poverty and provides education for the impoverished.

He wants people to be empowered. Chavez provides them with tools to improve their human-condition. Those whom never had a chance before, do now.

He is called a threat to democracy simply because he nationalized his oil fields. Instead of the majority of profits going to the oil companies, the majority of profits go back to Venezuela.

Chavez uses that money to accomplish his goals: ending poverty and providing education for the impoverished and much more.

Worthy goals don’t you think ?

serena1313 in dallas, texas | Monday, May 07 at 03:49 AM

Kudos for:
serena1313 in dallas, texas | Monday, May 07 at 02:49 AM
HAU!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Monday, May 07 at 09:30 AM

Soldiers among storm looting suspects.

All I guess I can say is this is sad if they are innocent but fair if they are guilty.

Just because they are uniformed people doesn’t mean they won’t commit a crime.

There is corruption in our police departments. Hospitals. Etc.

I don’t have a conclusion yet on this but I’ll let you know when I hear more on this story what I think.

Consider this my early thoughts on the subject.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Monday, May 07 at 10:04 AM

To mary in greenwood:  I happen to mention only the GOP because I do believe GOP principles of low taxes, small government, strong national defense (and no fear of using it), are principles which work, when actually put into practice.  I would actually prefer Libertarianism, or even Reform Party, principles.  However, neither has established a winning strategy at the national level, so I have what I have.  I’ve “thrown away” a lot of votes, so to speak, which did nothing but help put Democrats into power, which is not what I want.  I don’t believe in the usual Democratic principles of larger government, more welfare, higher taxes, etc. etc.  These things stifle the individual and kill the national spirit.  Therefore, I actually prefer it when Democrats do not adhere to their principles, because I believe their principles, in general, are misguided.

As for mary and I being the ones itching for the fight:  When our country, and our President, is wantonly attacked on this website, that is what starts the fight, at least with me.  If you all want solutions, promote your solutions.  Then we can discuss them, rather than merely continue to defend our President, our country, etc.

Unlike mary, I am not sad at the country I am leaving my children.  I am optimistic that we will eventually have something greater through the current struggle.  “what does not kill us makes us stronger”, so to speak.

To Rud:  read the WHOLE bible, not just the parts that suit your argument.  One can take any sentence out of context, and make any point they desire.  There is nothing in the bible that denigrates thrift, industriousness, or bettering ones lot in life.  However, there are many instances where ones faith, good works, and wise choices were rewarded with a more confortable life for self and family.  Nothing wrong with that.

As for Chavez..well, lets go with that for a moment.  In another line of discussion a “Hitler” comparison was made. 

Adolf Hitler was democratically elected as well.  Hitler also was loved by his people because he united them and gave them a sense of national purpose and hope for the future, and hope for a way out of the economic throes Germany was experiencing at the time. 

Hitler offered:  A good job, a full belly, and a good education, for every German.  Worthy goals, don’t you think?

Unfortunately, Hitler just happened to do all this by giving his people a common enemy to hate.  Once empowered by his people, he siezed the rest of his power as time and opportunity permitted. 

He also wanted complete personal control over the industries he felt were necessary to support his goals, excersizing the control with an authoritarian hand, often at odds with his own advisors, and often with disasterous (to him) results.

Chavez is a hugely popular populist leader in his own country, he knows how to win an election, but he has not one clue what to do with an oil company..Therefore, he siezes control, and then offers the folks he stole the oil fields from a percentage if they will just stick around and run the place for him.  There’s no guarantee that will happen, as you can imagine, the folks on the “short end” of the stick are in no mood to make nice.  (That’s like me stealing your car, but I’ll still let you drive, as long as you take me to the places I dictate)  So the folks who do the actual work might just leave and take their knowledge with them…then what is Chavez going to do with all that oil and no way to process it or get it to market??  The Venezuelan diet might just change in a hurry, but even Chavez will have a “hard sell” with his people, when he offers them a plate of petroleum.

So what’s he going to do?  Is he going to make slaves of the folks who are running the place???? 

Hitler did.

Cary Nickel | Monday, May 07 at 10:12 AM

Dog The Bounty Hunter

A story of American Justice gone horribly wrong.

I’d like your thoughts on this subject.

Click on my name below at the end of this post to be taken to my Myspace page where you will find an important video from Dog and Family.

Please return here and give me your thoughts on the subject.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Monday, May 07 at 10:16 AM

Sorry Cary but now you made me have to stir the pot.

(That’s like me stealing your car, but I’ll still let you drive, as long as you take me to the places I dictate.)

Hmm… Sounds Like Bush.

(That’s like Bush Saying I’ll let Karl Rove and Harriet Miers testify to congress as long as it’s not Under oath)

This is about the firing of those 8 attorneys.

Quote from news artice found here
http://www.theage.com.au/text/articles/2007/03/21/1174153159627.html

In a day of political drama, the Bush Administration had offered to send Mr Rove and Ms Miers, who no longer works at the White House, to Capitol Hill to be questioned by members of Congress in secret, and not under oath, with no transcripts made of the meetings.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Monday, May 07 at 10:29 AM

Oh, and as for pulling out of Iraq now and leaving things as they are…all I can say is, talk to the Cambodians about that. 

Sure, the folks in Iraq who want the power, but don’t have it, want us to leave.  But talk the those factions persecuted by Saddam Hussein for decades, and the last thing they want is for us to skip out on them. 

There are two sides to every story.

You said it yourself, Serena.  The terrorists, who are capitalizing on every division within Iraqi society, are small in number.  What’s more, most of them are coming from outside of Iraq. 

It doesn’t take many activists to create a huge problem for the majority who want peace and prosperity.

What needs to happen, is the people of Iraq must now unite against their enemies.  And outside of the news media, it is accepted within Iraq that the U.S. is NOT the enemy.  Read, or listen to, the interviews with most Iraqis, and you will hear that most Iraqis do not want us to leave.  They just don’t want our soldiers near their house, or want U.S. forces standing next to them, because the U.S. is a target of the extremists and they don’t want to get caught in the crossfire.

Every enemy of the United States is seeking to capitalize on the divisions within Iraq.  And the Iraqi people have made it plain they do not want to be dominated by ANY outside forces, the U.S., Iran, another middle eastern country, etc.  Most accept the fact that right now, the U.S. is a necessary player in their country, not to dominate, but to stabilize.

If we wanted to dominate in Iraq, it would be easy to do so.  We could do it from the air, without ever looking into one Iraqi’s eyes.  We did it in Germany and Japan 60 years ago, and we have much more “effective” weapons now.  If we didn’t care about the Iraqi people, it would be easy.  Simply bomb Iraq into the stone age, and then give the whole place to a friendly nation.  However, our mission in Iraq is a noble one.  I am convinced of that.  It’s not about oil, it’s not about domination.  It’s about having a friendly ally in the middle east, and fighting terrorists in their own sand box.  If the United States were merely being selfish, wanting nothing but empire, then we would simply lay waste to the country and then control what’s (and who’s) left, rebuilding in our own image.

Just because the whole operation wasn’t completed in ones “news cycle”, doesn’t mean the battle is lost.

George Bush never said the situation in Iraq would be easy.  He never said the war on terrorists would be easy.  Quite the contrary.  He’s repeatedly stated it would be long and difficult.  There would be many steps along the way, each building upon the prior.  When one mission is completed, the next begins.

serena, if you are truly a supporter of the Iraqi people, please explain why we should have left Saddam in power.  Is it truly better to live out one’s life with no hope whatsoever, rather than take a chance for hope and a better future?

Cary Nickel | Monday, May 07 at 11:00 AM

Robert:  The firing of the 8 U.S. attorneys was a non-issue from the very beginning.  Bush could have fired those attorneys for simply not caring for their hair styles.  If it were me, I would have actually said something like that, and then never spoke of the subject again.

Thankfully, the Imus story came along an killed off the U.S. attorney story, which was stubbornly clinging to life through the press. 

I guess there are times when the news cycle works in our favor!

U.S. attorneys are political appointees, period.  The biggest mistake was anyone in the administration apoligizing for their firing.  When the press smelled blood in the water, they were all over it….until the next big story came along. 

When Clinton fired EVERY U.S. attorney, merely to cover up getting rid of the one that was investigating him in Arkansas, it was a much larger story..but since the press was more forgiving of Clinton, he was treated with “kid gloves” on the issue.

Cary Nickel | Monday, May 07 at 11:12 AM

Rud, you are selective in your choice of quotes. I am not the only one to observe this. Sir, not unlike the AP, you stop short of the whole story. I also said to Justice is Blind: “there are some people of ALL faiths that take their beliefs to the extreme.”

Serena, you are correct. After I posted, I realized I should have mentioned that yes, he was elected by the people. My mistake. He is not a dictator….yet. Please read the following: http://elcubanocafe.blogspot.com/2007/04/maria-conchita-alonso-vs-hugo-chavez.html There are other websites with the same press release, but I thought that this might be an interesting one to use.

Robert, the attorneys are political appointees. They know when they take these positions that they could lose them in an instant. Janet Reno fired 93 attorneys (all but one). This is in the article you linked. Was there any testimony about that? No. Did anyone care (except those that were fired?) Evidently not cause there were no hearings or outrage. It just seems that all of our politicians have selective memories and selective outrage. It is okay for things to happen when their party is in charge, but when the shoe is on the other foot - forget it. I am speaking collectively here…all politicians. As for Miers and Rove having to testify in front of Congress. Why? As I said before, did this happen when 93 attorneys got the ax? So why now? It is a political firing Congress says…ooooh. Give me a break, are there any firings that are NOT political? They are all full of themselves and so much baloney, Robert. Self important blow hards. All of them trying to justify to the public, their paychecks. Bush is not making it easy for them. Try and look at it from that perspective, Robert. Even if you can’t stand the man, he is at least making Congress work for their money. I wish he had vetoed every stinking bill they had proposed. Every earmark, every pork barrel bill. That is where I am angry with the man. The topic of this page, you can’t veto the truth. I wish he had vetoed more. This last one bill had the audacity to list money for spinach farmers and peanut farmers in the same breath as our soldiers. It was loaded on the bill at the end, just in case they might not get enough votes to pass it, they had to try and buy a few. This is where all of our anger should be. At the two faced Congress. Say anything you want about Bush, but he doesn’t blow with the wind. He sticks with things (most times far too long). But Congress changes like they change their underwear.

And Cary, yes, what doesn’t kill me will make me stronger. I understand that. I doubt I will be still alive to watch this national strength occur. So,  I still wish my son was growing up in a different world.

mary in greenwood, SC | Monday, May 07 at 11:51 AM

It’s truly frightening that folks like Cary are out there and may actually believe what they write. So many of their talking points taken directly from the RNC and the Limbaugh and Hannity AM radio show. Here are some more talking points rarely brought up in your “truly noble cause”.

“imminent threat”
“smoking gun in the form of a mushroom cloud”
“WMD’s of every sort, chemical, biological, nuclear(or nucular as GWB puts it)
“ties to Al-Queda” (Well, at least they are there now that we destabilized the country.)

Mary and Cary still want to believe that might makes right or the ends justify the means. Learn the real history of U.S. foreign policy since the end of WWII and you’ll know what we are all truly up against. Find out how many governments we have directly and indirectly destabilized in the name of nothing more than right-wing ideology. ie: profits before people

I’m no fan of either party. I do agree with an earlier post by Mary or Cary that Al Gore is doing more and better work than he could have on the hill, but to continue to stand behind this president and administration, OR this Congress for that matter is simply defending the indefensible and only serves to discredit all of us. Admit the mistake and get out. After that, vote for a third, or fourth, or fifth party. We need to take it back.

crazy chester in New Hampshire | Monday, May 07 at 12:47 PM

Chester,

I like what you said other than the fact that you are putting down Congress.
Congress at least on the side Nancy Pelosi is on are doing all they can to end this war.

Please visit http://www.speaker.gov and look at what they accomplished in the first 100 hours then look at what they intended to accomplish in the first 100 days.

The only thing they are not doing right is capping gas prices.

It’s the people and I’m not only talking republicans. It’s the people who continue to support what is a hopeless cause in my view that make congress look bad when it’s not.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Monday, May 07 at 01:40 PM

Crazy chester in New Hampshire: I am guessing that this statement:“Mary and Cary still want to believe that might makes right or the ends justify the means.” I am guessing comes from what I said earlier - “I cannot imagine what would have happened in WW2 if we didn’t fight with every ounce of strength. No -  I can imagine….it was called Viet Nam. Politicians worried about being reelected fought the war instead of the generals. I want Gen. Petraeus to kick insurgents butt. Then and only then can we leave with our heads held high and know that we did the right thing. Bleeding hearts be damned.Let our soldiers soldier.” I do know our U.S. foreign policy. And I do not agree with all of it. I do know what we have done destablizes. However, I also know that our foreign policy (ie.Marshall Plan- rebuilding, etc.) helped Japan and Germany recover fully from wars THEY started. I also know that war is like pregnancy. You cannot be a little bit of either. You either go in and fight to win or don’t go in at all. That was my point. I am not saying that might makes right. If you are saying that going into a fight to win is right wing then so be it. I don’t know about you, but I never want to go into a fight with the plan for losing. I wasn’t in favor of invading Iraq. But we are there now, you cannot turn back the clock. We cannot leave Iraq again in a shambles. We left Viet Nam and we watched as the Vietnamese were mercilessly butchered by the Red Chinese. They didn’t have to be. The War Remnants Museum in Ho Chi Minh City explains that the North Vietnamese were basically down to their last resource and were about ready to capitulate when the American public, through television demanded a pullout now. We did. The rest is history. It is called the Tet Offensive. No, I know, we didn’t belong there either, but my point is that we were there. Cannot take it back so you must finish the job that was started. What will we call this pullout? The Iraq Offensive? The Baghdad Offensive?

mary in greenwood, SC | Monday, May 07 at 02:05 PM

Well Mary, I actually agree with you and it’s a well put statement. We are there and it is now necessary to do all we can to put back what we needlessly destroyed. We all have to ask ourselves why we are constantly in this situation? Wars and conflicts that no one agrees with, yet the powers that be may be counting on the fact that we should “stay the course” once we have rolled the ball.

The problem I currently have is how this is still being portrayed as a success story that just needs some more time and a bottomless pit of money to come to fruition.(don’t forget bodies you can’t photograph coming home in flag draped coffins..)

We bombed the infrastructure(again). We removed the existing army and set them loose without jobs or pay. We failed to seize on the opportunities when the Iraq population did welcome us. Now we are correctly viewed as occupiers and not liberators. The electricity is still not working reliably. The pipelines are no where near capacity. Iraqis wait in line for gasoline daily despite historically being the 2nd largest producer of crude. The water system and sewerage is unreliable.

There is more, but the point is that any of the above would make the U.S. population very disgruntled if it happened here. And still the administration has the gall to imply that Iraq’s problems are due to outside fighters or interference by Iran and not due to our lack of planning or restoration of basic services. Fighting to win means intelligence that is beyond reproach, and knowledge of culture and history prior to invasion, and significant planning for all potential civil situations that may arise after offensive combat has ended. It doesn’t take the best and brightest to have predicted the outcome of our actions in Iraq, simply a knowledge of human nature.
You ask what we call an Iraq pullout? That easy, the administration actually does very well in that dept.
“Clear Skies initiative” to mask increased air pollution limits.
“No Child Left Behind” to mask arbitrary assessments of our children and teaching professionals.
“Operation Iraqi Freedom” to mask a botched attempt to sell a pre-emptive, illegal and unjust invasion and occupation through fear.
“Mission Accomplished” to identify the very beginning of a daily body count of U.S. soldiers and Iraqi civilians.

I suggest “Operation Empty Nest” to imply that we are ready to let the Iraqis “children” live on their own now that we have shown them the beauty of democracy by force.

crazy chester | Monday, May 07 at 03:56 PM

Capping Gas prices???
What is wrong with you Robert?
Can’t you think of the bigger picture beyond your own wallet?
Now, if you are taking this position because of the gross(figurative and literal) profits of the major oil oligarchy, I sympathize, especially when so few Americans are aware that Exxon-Mobil just had their fine(for the Valdez fiasco..still unpaid)reduced by half recently despite several quarters of record profit.

I’m frankly of the mindset that to affect any change in behavior, you have to hit everyone in the pocketbook. We need to tack an extra dollar to every gallon of gas to accomplish several things:

Reduce our consumption and encourage efficient vehicles(the only time we’ve done this was after the artificial shocks to gas prices in the 70’s)
That in turn also naturally reduces our pollution emissions.

It will also reduce the coming shock on our population and economy of the coming oil production peak which will now be made worse by the growing economies of China and India. Oil will run out and the price will go into the stratosphere sooner or later.

Every bit of the additional revenue(minus administration costs) then needs to be solely earmarked for alternative energy research and development. We are still a great nation when it comes to R&D.

We developed the atomic bomb, satellites, the internet, subs that can stay underwater for a year, we landed on the moon and explored near space. But somehow, we can’t wean ourselves off petroleum? Do you wonder why? Follow the money…always follow the money.

crazy chester in New Hampshire | Monday, May 07 at 04:14 PM

crazy chester in New Hampshire - what excuse has the American public got for not being able to curtail their consumption? Did you read my earlier post about this?

mary in greenwood, SC | Monday, May 07 at 04:33 PM

to answer your question, no, I haven’t seen your post regarding this.
To answer the 1st question:
Well, absolutely no excuse at all(in my opinion at least)
Isn’t that the problem?
The problem as I see it is twofold. Lack of incentive since we still pay the least for gasoline.
The other is some form of collective amnesia about the 70’s and our lack of initiative to do anything pre-emptive(except go to war that is.)

The public and it’s leaders are generally crisis oriented. We refuse to even admit there’s a problem until there’s little to do but clean up the ensuing mess. Americans are so brainwashed by consumerism, capitalism, and our tax system that economic incentives or disincentives are the only thing that motivates 95% of us. In fact, the most overused excuse by both dems and neocons to keep from doing anything about our serious issues like emissions, energy use, is that any restrictions would cause harm to the economy. Follow the money. They have no conscience about mortgaging tomorrow for wealth today.

Crazy Chester in New Hampshire | Monday, May 07 at 05:53 PM

I find it ironic how in Vietnam we had a fighting force of young men who had no choice but to fight and people at home spat on them when they returned.

Now we have a fighting force of kids who VOLUNTEERED for it, and everyone’s all “We’re so proud of you. Thanks for fighting for us.”

What a bunch of ignorant asses.

MasterRanger in Birmingham, AL | Monday, May 07 at 06:09 PM

I will admit that a lot of American’s could afford to drive less but not me.
I park my car during the daylight hours when everyone else is driving around but by night visit my website and read my occupation. You will find I am a night time paper carrier trying to get out of papers but hitting dead ends everywhere I turn. Even when I told Social Security that I did not feel I was disabled I found out how hard it was to get a competitive job. I can hold a job that doesn’t pay a hill of beans because no one will fire me for my disabilities.
My boss doesn’t pay my gas to deliver those papers. I do. And I make a gross of 1,000 a month and then I have to turn around and fuel the car to deliver papers on that $1,000.00.
Right now it is $12.50 a night to deliver newspapers.
That comes to $387.00 in fuel each month. I’m left with a little under $700.00 to pay my bills and survive.
So as you can see until I get out of papers I cannot afford to park my car and I have a right to complain about gas prices.
Everytime gas goes up my monthly expenditure to deliver newspapers goes up.
But this is not about my expenditure.
The Oil companies have had the refineries down way too long for it to be the general public’s fault.
The oil companies have delayed bringing the Refineries back online so they could turn a profit at our expense.

By the way I drive a 6 cylinder and if the price to convert to hydro power would come down I would convert in a heartbeat because I believe oil is bad for the environment.
Hydro has to become affordable though and right now it’s not affordable by any means. Maybe for the upper class but did you ever think about the middle and low class?

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Monday, May 07 at 08:01 PM

I wholeheartedly AGREE with MASTERRANGER!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Monday, May 07 at 08:15 PM

IRAQ: The way the rest of the world understands it.

A middle-eastern islamic country was invaded and occupied by a non-islamic military force from another part of the world. The country’s government was overthrown, it’s leader captured and hanged, it’s infrastructure destroyed and hundreds of thousands of Iraqui citizens were killed in the process.

The incidence of violent crimes has greatly increased and a generalized atmosphere of insecurity predominates within the country. Areas in which a state of law and order prevails are now practically non-existent.

The vast majority of the country’s population opposes the continued presence of the occupying force - which labels those opposed to their presence “insurgents”, who have been killed, jailed and tortured by the invaders.

The presence of a non-islamic invading force in Iraq has angered islamics, propiciated reprisals and made attacking citizens from the invading country much easier for those offended by the invasion. As a result, considerable numbers of Islamic sympathizers from neighboring countries have entered Iraq in order to wage a guerilla war against the invading, non islamic forces; and the invasion has provided justification for doing so abroad, in the future.

Highly lucrative contracts for supplying the needs of the invading force, maintaining security and rebuilding the country’s infrastructure have been given to private corporations, many of which are close to the Commander-in-Chief, his principal collaborators or contributors to his parties electoral campaigns), with little or no oversight. A poor record of contract fulfillment or real benefits has been the result.

The cost to the USA for creating this historic fiasco includes hundreds of billions of dollars and the loss of both America’s financial reserves and it’s worldwide credibility.  Furthermore, resources required for investing in needed domestic scientific research, educational, health care and social support for disaster prevention and resconstruction have not been available, as a result of the senseless and fruitless waste of the funds diverted to Iraq.

At home and abroad, the constitutional rights of both US and non-US citizens have been disregarded and infringed on under the pretext of the “war on terror”.  Suspects are arrested, presumed guilty and held indefinately without reasonable access to attorneys, due process or the right of habeus corpus, and special secret military tribunals have been created in order to exempt the government’s disgraceful performance from public scrutiny and legislative accountability.

In addition to the thousands of Americans that have lost their life needlessly in Iraq, thousands of others have been physically maimed and / or psychological damaged, many permanently. The pronounced sense of disassociation generated by the flagrant and extreme disregard for human life in Iraq has afected those forced to serve there and has already left a mark on the tenor of life back in states.

Should the USA’s legislative branch and electorate fail to take corrective action with a reasonable degree of alacrity, this would suggest that the nation’s governmental structures and political processes are no longer capable of conducting the nations internal affairs in a responsable manner.  Impeaching both the Commander-in-Chief and the Vicepresident for their excesses, disregard for due process and his destruction of the nations reserves and human resources in favor of closely related corporate interests, may well be the most appropriate solution. Based on their record, they should no longer be entrusted with the conduction of the nation’s business.

The joint cost of the wars in afghanistan and iraq is now 10 billion a month, for a war that began on oct 11, 2002.

The current adminstrations goals in Iraq are so questionable that all members of the military whould be given the opportunity to opt out of service in iraq. At this point, no one, including members of the military, should be forced to go to Iraq against his or her will.  That’s the kind of legislation I would write.

Lastly, this post was contributed with the hope that some of those taken in by the hype may gain enough insight to see through it and act in accordance with their own conscience.

My apologies to those that suffered losses in this useless war, but I say this out of sympathy, courtesy and respect rather from than any sense of guilt. I’m sorry I wasn’t able to provide more information to more people, sooner.

For those that may disagree with my point of view: I am an American citizen exercising my constitutional right to free speech, and vale mas you respect it.

DH in Guadalajara, Jalisco | Tuesday, May 08 at 12:08 AM

A few bloggers, apparently members of or connected to the military, have mentioned “getting the job done” when referring to the US invasion of Iraq.

Forgive my candor, but the state of disassociation and detachment that statement displays ignores the nature of the systems that put the military where they are today:  Systems that they didn’t themselves construct, that provide them with no personal benefits and that turned them into pawns on a grander chessboard painted with patriotic colors and pretended dangers to the “homeland” that made it all OK.

Apparently, they aren’t aware that the principle driving the Iraq invasion and the bulk of the legislation the Executive Branch has sent to Congress was one and the same: MONEY!

Iraq is nothing more than a mechanism for transferring taxpayer’s dollars to private interests close to the Commander-In-Chief and his principle henchmen, and those proud to serve their country are not even in on the take; they’re simply tools, unaware that exploiting the world’s natural, institutional and human resources constitutes the motivating force driving the current administration’s actions.

(For another example of what’s going on, see <http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=14333> “This Alien Life: Privatized Prisons for Immigrants”.

The power to correct these injustices resides in anyone brave enough to speak out and take a personal stand.

Another blogger said that only those who have been in Iraq can understand what it’s really like there.  Well, I submit that anyone understanding the true nature of what is really going on there is *not* about to allow him or herself to be placed in that situation.

NO legitimate foreign policy goal can be obtained by a continued military presence in Iraq and in any case, the economic and social costs plus losses in human life on both sides are far too great. 

True bravery is shown by those refusing to participate in or support the slaughter, rather than swallow the propaganda or go along for the ride.
Finsh the job? The CIA predicted what would occur if the previous government was removed and history has born them out.

Iraq is about personal benefit. Tearing it down to establish a presence and “build it back” has been extremely profitable, for a few. As an oil wealthy ex-president’s son, the USA’s Commander-in-chief learned to abuse power early on. He used a military plane to visit his girlfriend when in the reserves, for example.

His being above the law has nothing to do with his being president. It has to do with his being George Bush and with being allowed to get away with it.

The office of President is consecrated in the law of the land and it’s powers are well defined. On principle, no power not specifically mentioned can be claimed or provided.

IOW, his power comes from and is limited by the law. No law, no power - unless he’s allowed to continue defrauding congress and the public indefinately.

DH in Guadalajara, Jalisco | Tuesday, May 08 at 12:17 AM

“imminent threat”
“smoking gun in the form of a mushroom cloud”
“WMD’s of every sort, chemical, biological, nuclear”
“ties to Al-Queda”

Every one of these ideas has been put forth by Democratic presidents, candidates, or congresspeople.  From Clinton, to Kerry, to Hillary.  So what’s the point?  It’s bad when Bush said it, but the Democrats who said the same thing get a pass?  Sorry, it doesn’t work that way.  If Bush lied, so did Clinton, Kerry, and Clinton, Jr.

To Masterranger:  I would have thought that rather than feel irony, you would feel proud that we, as a nation, have learned that our fighting people are deserving of our respect and admiration.  Those who spat upon or otherwise denigrated our Vietnam veterans were truly poor examples of U.S. citizenry and poor examples of humanity as well.

Robert:  Don’t count on Pelosi to do much for you.  Do a little research about her past actions and find our for yourself if she’s really for the “little guy”.  Hint:  Voting to place lucrative government contracts with her husbands company.

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 12:18 AM

Hey DH…I have no idea what your situation is that you are down in Old Mexico, but if things are so bad here in the U.S., then why are so many Mexicans dying to get here illegally??  Perhaps Mexico should get it’s own house in order before you start explaining to us what’s going on up here north of the border.

Oh, and France, FRANCE (I mean FRANCE!!) of all places, FRANCE(!!) elects a pro-U.S. president…only after 6 years of alleged Bush mismanagement????  What do the French people know that so many on this blog do not???

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 12:31 AM

Cary said:

> Hey DH…I have no idea what your situation is that you are down in Old Mexico,

That is correct, I’m sure you don’t.

> but if things are so bad here in the U.S., then why are so many Mexicans dying to get here illegally??

Like I said, it’s the money. And since half of Mexico’s territory was usurped by the USA, it’s only fair that our paisanos can visit their old stamping grounds and earn a few bucks.

> Perhaps Mexico should get it’s own house in order

We’re working on it. our elections are already cleaner than yours, and Mexico doesn’t invade other countries.

> before you start explaining to us what’s going on up here north of the border.

I figured that somebody had better let you know what’s going on, and it might as well be me.

Questioning my location seems to be easier for you than addressing my arguments.

What will you say whem Bill Richardson becomes President?

And when are you coming to visit?

DH in Guadalajara. Jalisco | Tuesday, May 08 at 12:46 AM

DH,

I don’t question your location, I question your sincerity.  Maybe you merely took what you made here in the states and left for Mexico to live in one of those U.S. enclaves where your dollar can go further, and you can get maid service for a buck a day.  Folks have been doing that for decades and I don’t have a problem with it.  But then don’t self-rightously preach to me about money. 

I traveled a lot in Mexico back in the 1970’s, when it was relatively safe to do so.  That was before the roving gangs were attacking tourists in the backcountry.  Then I started hearing about how U.S. citizens were spending years in Mexican prisons because they had spent .22 ammunintion cartridges in their pockets, among other various innocuous charges.  Since we have the freedom to own and use firearms up here north of the border, and I prefer to have the right to defend myself from the roving gangs south of the border,  I figured I’ve seen all I need to see down there.

Even back then we had to “grease the palms” of local authorities to get Mexico visas and good gasoline without a lot of “runaround”.  A lot of the gas we would buy on the road would have dirt and water in it.  We brought plenty of fuel filters and fuel pumps when traveling great distances.  And $20 to a local small time power broker would really motivate folks out of “siesta”, to do what civil servant do up here as part of their normal workday: their job.

My son just came back from a trip to El Paso to attend the dedication of the new “Onate’” monument.  My sons family name goes back to Spanish land grants here in New Mexico. All he could comment about looking across the Rio Grande into Juarez was: “No wonder they all want to come up here, Mexico looks like a slum.”  Quite an observation for a 14 year old.

It’s good to hear folks are working on the things down there.  However, Juarez doesn’t look much different today than it did two decades ago.

I assured him that the folks in Mexico keep the tourist spots like Guadalajara and Puerto Vallarta gussied up and “spit-polished” so as not to offend the folks who fly in from out of the country to spend their money.

As for Mexico not invading other countries:  Wrong.  Mexico is silently invading the United States as we speak.  We’re letting them get away with it for the moment, but not for long.  It’s interesting that if a U.S. Citizen attempted the kind of shenanigans the Mexicans do to cross our border illegally, they would get shot or do plenty of hard time in a mexican jail, rather than a meal ticket, free medical care, and a job.  Just look to your south D.H. 

Like Reagan used to say:  It’s the gate test.  Open the gate and see which way the people flow, and you know the situation within that country.

I wouldn’t have a huge problem with Bill Richardson becoming president.  A couple years ago he authorized a tax rebate which put a lot of the state’s tax surplus back into the hands of the folks.  He knows how to “buy votes” to win re-election.  He would be a “soft republican” like Bill Clinton.  However, Richardson hasn’t a chance on the national level. 

As for letting us “know what’s going on”:  I’ve heard all the same poppycock from the radical-left conspiracy websites.  Heck, I read them for a laugh.

And clean elections in Mexico???  That’s the most humourous statement of the day.  Did you miss the news of the riots and demonstrations in Mexico City last election??  And the charges of rampant voter fraud?  I guess you were too busy reading those radical-left websites for your news.

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 09:51 AM

I see Carey is Still stirring the pot as usual. troublemaker

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 10:26 AM

Troublemaker?  If speaking truth and opening the eyes of a few of the blind is being a troublemaker, then I am proud to do so.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53028

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 10:40 AM

Cary has now shifted his or her focus from Iraq to reminiscing about the old days in Mexico, the country that has undergone more change over the last 25 years than any other, without falling apart.

He/she said:

> Maybe .. left for Mexico to live in one of those U.S. enclaves

Not the case. And I’m not retired.

> where your dollar can go further, and you can get maid service for a buck a day…

Those days are long gone. 

> I traveled a lot in Mexico back in the 1970’s, when it was relatively safe to do so…  I figured I’ve seen all I need to see down there.

No wonder you’re so out of touch. You’re thirty some years behind.

> My son just came back from a trip to El Paso .. All he could comment about looking across the Rio Grande into Juarez was: “No wonder they all want to come up here, Mexico looks like a slum.” ... Juarez doesn’t look much different today than it did two decades ago.

It’s a maquiladora filled border town, closer to Dallas than Mexico City in every sense.

> Mexico is silently invading the United States as we speak ...

That’s so the food you eat can get picked.

> Reagan used to say: ... Open the gate and see which way the people flow, and you know the situation within that country.

The TJ / San Yisidro border crossing is the busiest in the world, with people, goods and services flowing both ways, 24 hours a day.

> I wouldn’t have a huge problem with Bill Richardson becoming president…

So you’re not as racist as you sound.

> However, Richardson hasn’t a chance on the national level. 

Time will tell.

> As for letting us “know what’s going on”:  I’ve heard all the same poppycock from the radical-left conspiracy websites. 

You mean like the NYTimes site?

> Did you miss the news of the ... demonstrations in Mexico City last election??  And the charges of rampant voter fraud?

The electoral results were extremely close and a full recount was not allowed. Since only paper ballots are used, this could have been done much more easily than in the USA, and probably should have been done.

The issue went to the supreme court, which made a questionable decision, like the one made in the USA in the year 2000, that denied a recount in FL.

And while Mexico has updated it’s electoral system, the USA continues to elect it’s president via the antiquated Electoral College.

Mexico’s presidential election is determined by a direct vote in which every vote counts. An Electoral Institute that includes representatives from all political parties operates the elections, and all political parties have representatives in each voting place and are present when the vote is counted.

Check out their website: <http://www.ife.org.mx>

There’s an English version, if you need it.

On a happier note, over 20 thousand people took off their clothes in Mexico City’s main square over the weekend.

I’m going to be pretty busy for the rest of the day, but if there’s anything more you want or need to know, just ask and I’ll get back to it when I can.

DH in Guadalajara, Jalisco | Tuesday, May 08 at 10:59 AM

30 years behind?  Nope.  I just like it here in my own country, just as millions of Mexicans also do, who aren’t given the chance to make it in their own country.

Juarez closer to Dallas in every sense?  My hind end.  It may be physically closer to Dallas, but it’s still in Mexico last I checked.  Quebec City is also closer to New York City, but that doesn’t mean French is going to be the predominant language in “The Big Apple” anytime soon.

New York Times website a radical left wing site?  Exactly!

U.S. enclaves where full-on housekeeping and maid service is a buck a day?  (Well, it may be two bucks a day now, since I havn’t really studied the subject for a few years.)  Alive and well.

We could pick our own food, thank you.

The Electoral College is perfect for our system of government.  It provides for a much more stable transition of leaders.  And it’s perfect for our version of a Republic. 

We don’t see the riots and such up here when our leaders change, and it keeps the will of the “majority” from crushing the rights of the minority.

But you don’t need me to tell you these things, you sound like a knowledgable person.  You know this stuff already.

Feel free to rebut, but as for me needing to know anything, it’s always interesting to hear other points of view, however misguided.

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 11:31 AM

Oh, and DH…allow me to suggest a far better source for your U.S. news than the NYT website:

http://www.foxnews.com/


How’s that for stirring the pot, Rud?

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 11:38 AM

Troublemaker!  If speaking truth? and opening the eyes of a few of the blind? is being a troublemaker, then I am proud to do so.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53028

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 09:40 AM
problem is , you don,t know the truth. you spread Gossip.
and if you are insisting to open eyes, then maybe you should start with yours first.
Look around your neighborhood.
6.6 Billion people now live on this planet.
China has 1.3 Billion
India has 1 Billion.
thats 2.3 Billion already.
N.America has LESS Than 300 million.’
odds are against n.america when it comes to fighting wars.
China and India already outnumber N.America 10 to 1.
imagine ten of them againsty one of you.
open your eyes little girl.
now , stir that pot.
oh, and yea. once you give Them freedom, you nor anyone can take that away.
think about that.
now , go ahead and stir that pot.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 12:44 PM

problem is cary, is you can,t handle the truth, and even if you knew the truth , you still wouldn,t know what to do with it!
God is Communist. now tell me, what would you do with That if it were true?
Kill God?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 12:48 PM

Hmmm…don’t remember discussing Communists, Rud…

What on earth are you talking about?

Use your own stats, Rud.  How many Iraqi civilians have died in the Iraq war?

How many Americans?

Now, extrapolate that.

And we havn’t even brought out the “big guns” yet.

I have nothing to fear.  I know the truth, and speak the same.  And you remember what is said about the truth? 

It shall set you free.

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 01:13 PM

The Truth will set us away from the likes of you.
the truth is that God IS Communist.
God Hates free.
God wants to be your Commander but can,t
because you want to be free.
it is you freedoms that will kill you. not God.
I told you that you couldn,t handle the truth .
please when you quote the bible, give REF:

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 01:19 PM

remember what is said about the truth?

It shall set you free.
where did this come from?
where in the bible?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 01:20 PM

Cary, what did you mean by Use your own stats, Rud.  ?
i,m not making those stats up. heres where i found them.
http://www.tranquileye.com/clock/
http://www.census.gov/ipc/www/world.html

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 01:24 PM

Who’s talking about the bible?  I was quoting The Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King.  He may have been quoting the bible.  Ask him.

Also, I never said you made the stats up.  Quit being so paranoid.

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 01:51 PM

Oh, now you think I,m paranoid.
typical.
has nothing to do with paranoia.
just the truth.
like it or not.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 02:53 PM

by the way (s)cary, have you personally ever been in a war?
thought not.
ever been poor?
have you ever seen poor people?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 02:56 PM

I dunno WHAT my husband’s fighting for.  Ummmmm….oil???????????

T | Tuesday, May 08 at 04:51 PM

I AM SOOOOO SICK OF THIS MAN!!!!! 

The Pentagon tells 35,000: Prepare to Deploy.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070508/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_iraq_troops

This was not part of the deal!  And Gates has turned out to be a HUGE disappointment.  I was so hopeful that he would be a breath of fresh air.  He told everyone what they wanted to hear, then when he got the job he commenced to dancing with the DEVIL.

2009 CANNOT COME SOON ENOUGH!

T | Tuesday, May 08 at 04:57 PM

To Cary who suggested http://www.foxnews.com as a better source for news you are wrong but at the same time I won’t defend my source for news either because it is also 1 sided.

Your source for news Cary is Fox News which is nothing but for the Republicans and 1 sided toward the Republicans.

My source for news is CNN which is nothing but for the democrats and 1 sided toward the democrats.

Let me suggest a very neutral source for both you and me. It’s called the Newshour with Jim Lehrer and you will find it on your local public broadcasting station every weekday night.

It would do us both good to focus on a neutral source for news.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Tuesday, May 08 at 05:30 PM

Actually, CNN has Glenn Beck, and last I heard Bill Bennett, on board.  Conservatives both.

Fox has Shepard Smith, Alan Colmes, Greta Van Susteren, who lean left.

But more folks watch Fox News than CNN, MSNBC, or any other news outlet…heck, are there any others?

I really appreciate your attempts to be balanced on the issue, Robert.  I really do.  I hope this doesn’t sound condescending at all, because I do not mean it that way at all.

Actually, I listen to NPR on the radio a lot, since I drive a lot for my job.  But NPR does really make me angry with it’s anti-United States rhetoric.  I can’t believe they spend my tax money on that stuff.

And Rud, the only “poor people” I have ever seen are those who have lost hope.  In about 1984 I lived out of a 1967 Mercury Montclair, with a $4 per hour job.  Used to bathe every day in a lake or in irrigation canals.  Does that count as “poor” to you?  Personally, I didn’t think I was poor.  It was what I needed to do at the time to get by.

Cary Nickel | Tuesday, May 08 at 07:17 PM

Cary:
You said it yourself. actually , you used a double speech in it. here is exactly what you said. reread it above:
1.the only “poor people” I have ever seen are those who have lost hope.
2.Personally, I didn’t think I was poor.
so, Did Cary lose Hope then?
You said you didn,t think you was poor so obviously you didn,t lose hope.
do you think Afgans or Iraqis should lose hope?
that is if they aren,t dead yet?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Tuesday, May 08 at 07:43 PM

i can not stay here any more

Albert in New York | Wednesday, May 09 at 01:57 AM

You mean the Iraqis who survived Saddam Hussein, and the Afghans who survived the Taliban?  Of course they should have hope. 

It’s all about attitude.

Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 09 at 09:40 AM

To “T”:  I suggest you ask your husband himself what he is fighting for, and go from there.

Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 09 at 09:43 AM

No. I mean the Iraqis, and the Afghans who (so far)survived the Americas so called War on Terror? or better phrased;
No. I mean the Iraqis, and the Afghans who (so far)survived the the american terrorists . you for one are part of the terror ring whether you know it or not.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 09 at 10:51 AM

the Afghans were not struck by the Taliban.
the Afghans were struck by america.
sure shows your insight.
and your attention span. none.
and the Iraqis were not struck by Saddam.
in other words(i guess i must spell it out for you)
Saddam nor the Taliban declared war on Afganistan or Iraq.
America(republicans to be exact)Did.
is that simple enough for you to understand?
I hardly doubt it.
stay out of politics, please!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 09 at 10:58 AM

So Cary, when are YOU going to Enlist?
you,re so gung ho. You might make a great Blackwater Mercenary.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 09 at 11:01 AM

So Cary, what do YOU think? Would You make a great Blackwater Mercenary?

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 09 at 11:07 AM

Imagine the Awesome responsibility of just a one star Chinese general protecting over a BILLION Chinese citizens.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 09 at 11:20 AM

Someone remind Cary that many less Iraqi’s have survived our sanctions and “liberation” than their time under Saddam.. . .ironic, maybe.

crazy chester in New Hampshire | Wednesday, May 09 at 04:00 PM

President Threatens Veto Again!

An immediate press release has become available at http://www.speaker.gov saying that the president will veto the revised Iraq bill as long as it only gives him 1/2 the funds he’s asking for and only gives him 2 months worth of funds.
Again the President thinks he calls every shot.
  Hopefully Congress will override this time with a 2/3 majority.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Wednesday, May 09 at 04:36 PM

I’ll offer some advice, take it or leave it:

Stop living in 24 hour news cycles and start thinking long term. Period.

Apparently, I need to remind some folks that the U.S. Civil War was bloodier than both WW1 and WW2, Korea, and Vietnam COMBINED, as far as U.S. deaths go.  Yet the United States emerged from the Civil War a stronger and better country.

Unless you think Iraqis are somehow inferior to us here in the U.S., why would you think Iraq can’t emerge from their current strife the same way?

Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 09 at 04:41 PM

He Robert, no offense meant, but in this case the President DOES call every shot.  That’s what the veto is for.  If congress can muster the 2/3’s, more power to them…

Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 09 at 04:49 PM

Cary Nickel | Wednesday, May 09 at 03:41 PM
How many civil wars occurred before america was discovered?
any idea?
aamof, how many wars before Europe became populated?
when you start talking war history, you gotta long way to go before you even get to america.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 09 at 04:51 PM

hint: go back to history classes.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Wednesday, May 09 at 04:53 PM

Nouri Al Maliki continues to drag his feet.

The Proof: V.P. Cheney is over there right now telling him to pick up the pace.

We will not stabilize Iraq as long as P.M. Al Maliki continues to delay his stabilization efforts.

There was talk in the news this morning about firing him as P.M. and putting someone new in.

Yes wars take time to win but not 10 years.

I’m sorry I just don’t buy into this continued failing strategy.

On the other hand I also do not agree with the new bill congress has drafted but at least at the same time our troops would be getting funded until the stalemate ended.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Wednesday, May 09 at 06:13 PM

Menja ne predavaj ya tak hoch. Oral Zelde.

Oral Zelde in http://pn5.com | Wednesday, May 09 at 06:27 PM

No need to go back to any history classes.  We’re talking U.S. history and U.S. foreign policy here, as it relates to the current Iraq situation.

As for the Al Maliki government in Iraq. I agree with Robert on one point.  Maliki needs to pick up the pace over there and start getting things done.  I don’t have unlimited patience with him either.  If he doesn’t want his country left in turmoil, he’d better start showing us something.  If the Iraqis are unable, or unwilling, to do what needs to be done to stabilize their country, then we will be forced to do it all for them, and if it comes to that, it should be on our terms and our terms only.

Cary Nickel | Thursday, May 10 at 12:24 AM

Meanwhile American families are left in turmoil,...no explanation needed on this topic . ie, hurricanes tornadoes,natural disasters,military family funerals,drugs,guns,porn,child abuse,good old fashion american violence.
go to hell .

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 10 at 08:27 AM

Wow Rud!!  You sure do display the typical lib bitterness!  Turn off the tube for awhile and learn to live life!  Good grief!

I could answer every topic you bring up, point by point, but what would BE the point?  You are un-teachable and closed minded.  And when you are intellectually out-gunned, you resort to more profanity and name calling.

No where in the United State are families “left” in turmoil. 

Furthermore, it’s not the government’s job to “fix” every misfortune that befalls our citizens.

Cary Nickel | Thursday, May 10 at 10:59 AM

No where in the United State are families “left” in turmoil.Cary Nickel | Thursday, May 10 at 09:59 AM

like i said cary, fuck you and your freedumbs. i sure as hell will not defend yours bitch.

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 10 at 12:34 PM

Seems we covered this earlier, Rud.  No need for me to repeat myself.

Cary Nickel | Thursday, May 10 at 01:14 PM

No where in the United State are families “left” in turmoil.Cary Nickel | Thursday, May 10 at 09:59 AM
tell that to the military families that lost loved ones do to your ignoramic unjust war. you dumbass bitch

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Thursday, May 10 at 05:56 PM

Their loved ones are American Heroes who gave their lives to protect OUR lives and freedoms, Rud.  Even your life and freedoms. 

I sincerely hope some day you will appreciate it.

No where in the United States are families “left” in turmoil, Rud.  Feel free to quote me again.

Cary Nickel | Thursday, May 10 at 11:57 PM

Its incredible that Democrats(liberals) never learn from history, We lost vietnam because we dont have the courage to finish what we start. Many people suffered at the hand of the communists take over in South Vietnam, to this day the Montangards suffer greatly because they helped fight the North vietnamese. It seems the same thing will happen in Iraq if the democrats get there way. I wonder what George Patton,General Mcarthur would think, they are probably rolling in there graves. We have become gutless and lost our convictions. I wonder if Ronald Reagan would have just let the communists have there way if the berlin wall would have fallen. in ending let me say this “Evil prospers when good people do nothing” and remember what we do will echo in eternity and our childrens future

joselito lopez in seattle, wa | Friday, May 11 at 02:04 AM

Chapeau! As a long-time observer of Mideastern politics - and inside-tracker of some alternative routes out of the Iraq quagmire (http://www.solami.com/UNGA.htm ¦
.../diplomacy.htm) - I’d appreciate your help for getting into contact with some of the current and former staffers on the Hill - on either side of the ailes - who you think would be receptive and should be made aware of the so far mostly side-lined if not forgotten
international law and other elements we are working on (e.g.: .../pelosi.htm ¦ .../ashur.htm
¦ http://www.aemam.net).

Thanks in advance. With best wishes and regards

Anton Keller, Secretary, Good Offices Group of European Lawmakers
+4122-7400362   +4179-6047707   .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)

Anton Keller in Geneva | Friday, May 11 at 09:18 AM

Their loved ones are American Heroes who gave their lives,period!
money, greed. not worth defending, free? who?what?where?why?
you know nothing.if freedumb is so great then why didn,t God give it to the entire world?
because its NOT.
and Yes,
in the United States are families “left” in turmoil,period!
Ever heard of HOMELESS VETS? just type in google search"HOMELESS VETS”!

(sfc ret u.s.army1976-1997)!Christopher Edison Rud | Friday, May 11 at 06:46 PM

Once again, Rud.  I’m sorry for your bitterness.  However, there’s nothing I can do about your self-loathing and your hatred for your country.

All you are capable of is bitching, whining, and complaining about your lot in life.

I have better things to do with my time than read any more of your tripe.

All in this country are offered the same opportunity.  It’s up to each individual to take advantage of that opportunity, or to choose not to.

It seems simple, Rud.  If you are so unhappy with the United States that you cannot find one thing good about our country, then perhaps you should seek out some other place where you can live out your remaining years in happiness. 

Life is far too short to be in such despair!  We’re obviously too far gone for you to have any hope of this country ever changing to suit you.  Frankly, I would hate to live in the country you would find acceptable.  Freedom is far to important to me.

I, and the majority of Patriotic Americans, will just have to accept we can’t make all of the people happy all of the time.

Cary Nickel | Saturday, May 12 at 01:26 AM

John Kerry, and Jane Fonda are my heroes

just a thought | Sunday, May 13 at 04:28 PM

Vasilis in Tunisia, Long Beach | Sunday, May 13 at 07:01 PM

Panayotis in Sweden, Truro | Friday, May 18 at 08:24 AM

Equal Opportunity no longer exists in America.
I work for a newspaper because I can’t get another job with my disabilities and If I do get my disability money back because I can’t work they only pay me $500.00 a month yet If I go out and take a job to supplement it they take dollar for dollar away. Equal Opportunity has not existed for years now. Not only under this President though. I will admit that even back to the time I was a kid under Senior Bush as well as Bill Clinton it was still tough to survive. Don’t know if the job market was any better than or not but I do know that it is hard for anyone with a mental disability to hold a job.
I know I’ve gone through Vocational Rehabilitation because I told Social Security I thought I could work only to find out that my disabilities definitely did discriminate.

Bottom Line: Not everybody has equal opportunity.

Robert in Corvallis, OR | Tuesday, May 22 at 10:49 AM